There are numerous problems with this line of thinking from a progressive Christian perspective.
i. The lack of emphasis upon Jesus' 30-33 years of life - his way, teachings, and example.
2. Reducing the faith to a cerebral matter of what individuals accept as accurate information.
3. The view that salvation is largely a matter of where we'll go when we die.
4. The idea that it is Jesus' death on the cross that allows anyone to experience salvation.
5. The notion that hell is even a Christian concept - it isn't.
I addressed all of these matters in full and in depth in my book Kissing Fish: ch ristianityfor people who don't like christianity. I've avoided addressing these matters as a blog as they frankly are complicated and require, and are worthy of, much back-story, nuance, and sophisticated discourse. However, it's become clear that there's a need for a briefer synopsis that's easily accessible and shareable online.
Here we go. Re: I & 2, It's a damn shame and tragedy that so many Christians focus on Jesus' death and not on his life. Mel Gibson's movie The Passion of the Christ is a keen example of this distortion of authentic Christianity. The idea that simply accepting X, Y, and Z about Jesus' person, death, and resurrection is what matters - and not focusing on his teachings in the Sermon on the Mount, and looking at his actual ways of practicing his religion in interacting with and relating to people - is missing the forest for the trees (and only a tiny number of trees at that). It's an epic adventure in missing the point. One can believe "all the right things" and not be able to love their way out of a wet paper bag. It's loving that matters. (I Corinthians 13 (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/? sear ch=I+Corinthians+13))
priorities - what various religions teach that pertains to Jesus' death and resurrection. Sure, Muslims don't think Jesus was killed, and Buddhists and Hindus don't believe in resurrection. And Hindus have many gods to worship and Jews only one. So what? Those are hardly what Jesus and his message are all about. In other words, the things that conservative Christians tend to think are the essential foundations - aren't. Christians are called to follow the religion of Jesus - not the religion about him.
The graphic featured is one that is an obvious play and attack on the many variations of the symbolic COEXIST slogan featured on bumper-stickers across the land.
(http 5: //wp -media. p atheos.com/blogs/sites/396/2o15/o4/images.jp g) Such stickers are meant to convey a sense of appreciating the diversity of world religions and a deep valuing of all of them - including the common ground among them.
Such stickers are an invitation to remind us of a higher calling to "pray well with others."
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(https://wp-
media. p atheos.com/blogs/sites/396/2o15/04/I 10378 26_104679474201 from a progressive Christian perspective, Jesus is "the way, the truth, and the life," and all who follow Jesus' way, teachings, and example - the way of unconditional love, of radical hospitality, of loving-kindness, of compassion, of mercy, of prophetic speaking truth to power, the way offorgiveness, of reconciliation, and the pursuit of restorative justice - by whatever name, and even if they've never even heard of Jesus, are fellow brothers & sisters in Christ and his Way.
To the extent that other world religions are about instilling, fostering, and nurturing those universal values - we see Christ in them. This is also true for secular NGOs such as Global One Foundation (http://www.globalonefoundation.org/).
We might also say that on a surface level, all of the major world religions are the same. On a deeper level, all of those religions are very different. And on a still deeper level, all of those religions are the same.
That said, we're rather enamored by the uniqueness of the Jesus story and we invite others to join us in sharing in that specific life-giving journey - even if we feel no dire need to convert anyone.
UPDATE: I'm adding the following as a post-script. I had posted it as a comment in the feedback thread below, but wanted to make sure every one could see it:
Roger here. In my book Kissing Fish, I stated that "each of the major world religions are like wells, and if you go deep enough into any of them, you'll hit the same aquifer and Source." I firmly believe that. However, I'm particularly drawn to the well of Christianity.
I don't literally think that all religions are *exactly* the same.
German, English, Korean, or Swahili are all valid, effective, languages, but they aren't exactly the same. The same is true for the major world religions. There are differences to be sure among the religions - but to the extent that they each seek to foster increased love, compassion, justice, mercy, etc - they're doing the same work and helping people connect with themselves, each other, and beyond.
That said, IMO, those various religions have differing capacities and histories in doing those particular things. Christianity, at its best, is a particularly effective vehicle for helping people become more loving and just. One of the key reasons that I'm a Christian is because of its long history of prophetically speaking truth to power and seeking to challenge and change unjust social systems. Many of the Asian religions (Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism) have tended to avoid saying that there is right and wrong or good or bad. Such a philosophy can reduce personal suffering via letting go of certain mindsets. That said, they also tend to result in moral quietude in the face of mass injustice and end up fostering increased social suffering. Case in point, the many centuries of the oppressive caste system in India.
(h ttps://www.pa th eos.co m/blogs/rogerwolsey/2o19/o9/lio ns-and-tigers-and-pro gressives-oh -my/roger-wolsey-h eadsh o t/)
Rev. Roger Wolsey is an ordained United Methodist pastor who directs the Wesley Foundation at the University of Colorado at Boulder, and is author of Kissing Fish: christianity for people who don't like christianity
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BrotherRog Mod • 4 years ago
"To claim God exclusively for Christians is to make God too small and in a real sense is blasphemous. God is bigger than Christians and cares for more than Christians only." ~ Archbishop (Emeritus) Desmond Tutu
Roger Wolsey
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Marc Herman • 4 years ago
The Man of Nazareth stands for a message that has a unique dimension that no other religious system or spiritual movement has, a message he has exhibited not though a theory or a book but through an intense and short passage on this earth — the startling news that God desires to be like us.
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Keith A. Jenkins • 4 years ago
John 14:6 can easily be understood in a way that does not lead to Christian exclusivism. Here's one way, from God Explains It All, a series of fanciful, off-beat conversations between God and me on a range of topics:
You always need to remember: I love all of my creatures; I want to be in a loving, life-affirming, mutual relationship with all of my creatures; I want all of my creatures to be the best they can be; and I never give up. From these truths, all else follows.
So you just eventually forgive everyone, no matter what they did, and whether or not they repent, and let them into Heaven.
I don’t “let” anyone “into” Heaven. Only those who are suited for Heaven can live in my presence. And only those who realize their need for me and allow
see more
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Alicia Simpson • 4 years ago
Jesus of Nazareth was born near Passover in the year 6 BCE.
Jesus began his public ministry in 26-27 CE (John the Baptist was arrested in 27 CE).
The crucifixion occurred on Friday 3 April 33 CE at the age of 39.
Jesus' public ministry lasted for 6 or 7 years.
John recorded the 3 times Jesus went to Jerusalem for the Passover, not every Passover that Jesus celebrated.
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IamPERFECTinSOmanyWAYS 4 Alicia Simpson • 4 years ago • edited
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JESUS FREAK ALERT
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A
BrotherRog Mod 4 Alicia Simpson
• 4 years ago • edited
Possibly. That is certainly one possible dating. Please know that there is no consensus among the scholars regarding the exact date of Jesus birth or his death. He could've been born as late as four B.C.E. and could've died as early as 30 CE. Peace. - Roger https://en.m.wikipedia.org/...
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Alicia Simpson
• 4 years ago
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4 BrotherRog
Herod the Great died in 4 BCE (most likely March) so 4 BCE is the latest that Jesus could have been born.
The key is understanding what the Star of Bethlehem really was. One clue is what the Magi told Herod as to when they first saw it. Herod was a bit paranoid, so it is likely that he doubled what ever they told him. Remember he told his men to kill all male infants and toddlers under the age of 3 (2 years old and under — remember you are 2 right up until the day before you turn three). This gives us a framework of about 15 to 18 months as to the timing the Magi gave Herod.
In February of 5 BCE there was a comet that was visible in the middle east (Matthews description of its behavior works well with a comet and, in the 1st cent r the onl astronomical objects
century, the only astronomical objects recognized were the sun, the moon, and the stars and a comet qualified as a star) through the middle of April. Further in the year 7 BCE there was an unusual set of planetary alignments, Saturn and Jupiter aligned in Pisces 3 times, the last being December of 7 BCE. This alignment is something that occurs about once every 1,000 years or so. Recognizing that the "Star of Bethlehem" may well have been tow separate astronomical events and also realizing that Jesus must have been at least 8 months old to survive a trip from Bethlehem to Egypt, we begin to understand that the Magi came around when Jesus was about 1 year old.
So if the comet was the second part of the Star of Bethlehem and the unusual alignment was the first part, counting 15 months from the last of the three alignments, we come to late March or early April for the birth of Jesus in 6 BCE.
As for his date of death, scholars now believe that Passover of 31 CE and 33 CE are the two most likely times. The 30 CE only comes from the assumption that his ministry lasted 3 years, based on the Gospel of John, a very unreliable assumption. Of the two most likely years, only in 33 CE was there a Lunar Eclipse visible from Jerusalem on the Friday evening, the start of Passover. Peter specifically references a prophecy that specifies a Blood Red Moon, which is how a lunar eclipse was usually described.
So, his birth was most likely between March and June of 6 BCE and his death was most likely on 5 April 33 CE. These are the dates we should be basing things on, at least until we get better information.
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Catherine Averill Howland • 4 years ago
I had 3 international students in a group - 3rd grade boys from India, China and Malaysia who practiced Mormonism, Christianity and Islam. That year Ramadan and Eid fell right about the same time as Christmas and they were talking about the upcoming break from school and what they were going to do. A lot of questions about what they believed ensued and so we decided to learn about their different faiths. We laid ground rules about proselytizing and wrote home for any information they could send, and did some internet research. They discovered that: 1. They all believe there is one God who is supreme. 2. Their God has a messenger in the form of an angel named Gabriel and 3. Gabriel was the messenger who told Mary she'd give birth to Jesus, revealed the tablets to Joseph Smith and gave the Qur'an to Mohammed. Their synopsis was life changing for me - They said, "Our God told each of us and our 'people' what we needed to hear and gave us what we needed to have WHEN we needed it and in a way we could understand. Isn't it cool that we are more alike than we are different."
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Alan Harmony • 4 years ago
You never get past the first and huge concern that Christianity is an idolatrous cult. At the Council of Nicea less than 15% of all the bishops had a conference and at the bidding of Constantine 'unanimously' voted Jesus to be a god of Rome. That act turns a messiah into an idol of Rome. The name was already problematic by virtue of the belief and practice being called Christianity from people in Paul's area of teaching. The lessons Jesus taught went from access to inspiration (The Way) to a shift towards idolizing the teacher. Most clergy rationalize that it's the same thing... but it isn't. Look around you and see how many churches teach the lessons to get the inspiration from dreams or visions (Num 12: 6, Job 33:15 & Joel 2:28). Then look at how many make reference to such a use as being heretical or satanic or ignore, deny or impugn that use.
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Edwin Woodruff Tait
• 4 years ago
4 Alan Harmony
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This is fake history. Nicea didn't "vote Jesus to be a god of Rome," and Jesus' divinity was taught long before that.
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BrotherRog Mod 4 Alan Harmony
g
• 4 years ago • edited
I hear you however there have been many reforms that have taken place since then. Progressive Christianity is the movement that I advocate, am part of, and am blessed by. Progressive Christianity could more rightly be called "conservative Christianity" as it seeks to conserve the values, teachings, and way that made the faith a gift to the world in the first place. Overtly naming this as progressive Christianity however conveys a progressive message that may reduce wariness and apprehension about Christianity as a way that makes sense in the 21st century. Peace. - Roger Wolsey
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BrotherRog Mod • 4 years ago
"the most recent Christological controversies have been generated
not so much by alternative interpretations of the sacred text, as by
constructions that simultaneously recognize the validity of many
elements of orthodox Christology while setting it in a framework that
relativizes it. Thus Panikkar argues that, while Christ is incarnated in
Jesus, Christ cannot be identified with Jesus: Christ is always more
than Jesus. Christianity may have a monopoly on Jesus, but not on
Christ. God has disclosed himself in Christ, and doubtless for
Christians the historical connection is Jesus. But for Hindus, Christ
has manifested himself in a different form appropriate to that religious
structure. Thus there is a “cosmic Christ.” Rahner would add that this
means there are “anonymous Christians,” people who are Christians
without ever having heard of Christ, or even in some cases who have
repudiated Christianity as they have experienced it while accepting the
(unrecognized) “Christ” in their own religious heritage."
A. Scott Moreau, Harold Netland, and Charles van Engen, Evangelical
g , g
Dictionary of World Missions, Baker Reference Library (Grand Rapids, MI;
Carlisle, Cumbria, UK: Baker Books; A. Scott Moreau, 2000), p. 190.
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BrotherRog Mod • 5 years ago
“. . . but the Universe is an awfully big place. There is room enough for an awful lot of people to be right about things and still not agree.”
― Kurt Vonnegut, The Sirens of Titan
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BrotherRog Mod • 5 years ago • edited
The mystics from each of the world religions tend to have more in common with each other than they have in common with the more conservative members of their respective faith traditions. - Roger Wolsey
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PremiumOsmium > Guest • 5 years ago
But as you pointed out, every religion makes claims as to how the world works and things that happened. Isn't it important to know whether or not what you believe is actually true? Did Jesus die and rise from the dead? Did an angel dictate the Koran to Muhammad? Did Joseph Smith find golden plates containing a new gospel of Jesus? Did all of that happen? Some of it? None of it?
If you say that the message of Jesus is more important than the claims about him, then fine. But then the question becomes, "Why"? Should we follow Jesus's message because doing so is good for people? Or should we follow Jesus's message because it comes directly from a god and we are commanded to do so? If you go by the first option, then who Jesus was or what he actually did or said becomes totally irrelevant. If you go by the second option, then you need to show some solid justification as to why you believe that to be true.
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BrotherRog
• 5 years ago
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Mod > PremiumOsmium
i i h d d d h
Keen insights, and I devoted the 398 pages of my book "Kissing Fish: christianity for people who don't like christianity" to delving into those very questions.
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Cyndi Bertone • 6 years ago
I've been scrolling through the comments on this article and some of the good (and some of the not so good) dialogue about it. Just have to add my thoughts. Articles like this make my heart sing. But it wasn't always this way. About 14 years ago I started practicing yoga. I totally ignored all of the philosophy until I was about 6 years in when I started to notice some similarities between my teachers "dharma" talks (lessons in philosophy) and sermons that I'd hear on Sunday. I'm a bottom line kind of person, so I am always looking for the message. Now let me say that although the origins of yoga (5000 years ago) are from an area in the world that heavily practices Hinduism, yoga philosophy is over and over proclaimed NOT to be "religious" but rather spiritual. That's because, as I came to realize, the messages are available to be heard in many different contexts. The details of the stories (the philosophy of yoga and the messages of the sermons) were always very different, but the underlying message would be the same. Very often those messages were pretty much of the theme of the 10 commandments. At some point I began praying quite seriously for guidance because I felt so conflicted: how can these philosophy messages resonate so deeply in my core, but it's not from the religion that I know and love? The message I got over and over again was find a way to reconcile it because both are valid. That reconciliation came for me when I came to this realization: if God is the greatest teacher, and he has to explain this extraordinarily difficult concept of who He is, a good teacher would use different frames of reference to teach to different students. So in one area of the world, His message became one religion, in another part of the world it came through as another and so on. How CAN one religion be the ONLY religion?? Even the bible tells us that God's greatness is completely beyond our limited comprehension. At the core of all the faiths, the message I keep hearing is take care of each other, love each other and love God. That's my bottom line. All the rest gets lost in details.
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Chad Varner • 6 years ago
Following the two statements attached in picture is the hardest thing anyone on this Earth can do.
Guess who said them. The life of that person showed the way. It is the truth. There is only 1 true religion. The good in all the others is just a reflection upon Him.
Everyone in this world is a Christian, whether they practice it or not.
⛺
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James • 6 years ago
The one problem that I have with posts like this, as well as the idea of Christian Universalism as a whole, is its tendency to reduce the significant cosmological, material, theological, philosophical, and anthropological perspectives of various religions down to a moral-ethical paradigm that is grounded within a Christian context (assuming that the moral-ethical paradigms operate in the same way to Christianity, which they do not), and then presumes that so long as non-Christians act according to said paradigm they will have access to the benefits of Christian eschatology, even if that person has chosen a life and faith that do not share that eschatology. It erases people's free will, context, experiences, and agency that would either empower them to reject the Christian Gospel. It is well intentioned, to be sure, but you do a disservice to the great diversity of religions of the world by boiling them down to a Christian-centric moral-ethical paradigm.
S. Paul said for us to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. I think I will follow his lead, and let God handle and manage the things I do not understand.
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Edwin Woodruff Tait > James • 4 years ago
This isn't necessarily about universalism, but about pluralism.
It's quite possible to be a universalist without reducing Christianity to a "moral-ethical paradigm" (Barth is a striking example).
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Chad Varner 4 James • 6 years ago
As a Christian, I give up my free will for His Will.
Everyone is a slave to someone/something.
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BrotherRog Mod 4 James
• 6 years ago • edited
I disagree. People's free will is not at all erased by what I've shared. Moreover, I haven't "boiled down all religions" to being Christian. Yes, I'm Christo-centric, and I'm writing to a largely Chriso-centric audience, but Christianity doesn't have a monopoly on compassion, justice, love, mercy, forgiveness, etc. Seems to me that you're the one who is saying that those are Christian virtues ("moral-ethical paradigm"). Agreed, we are called to work out our own salvation. Peace.
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Janet Douglass • 6 years ago
Thanks Roger. Posted on my (UM) Church Facebook for people to read and remind them again of these persistent distractions to being church in the
world and for the world.
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Gle3nn • 6 years ago
So when in Egypt, everyone was warned to sacrifice a lamb and put the blood on their door so that the angel of death would pass over them. Were the ones who chose not to do so, spared the consequences of not following God's direct instructions?
So now when Jesus presents himself as the ultimate sacrifice for us, if we choose not to accept his blood as our covering, why would we not expect the same consequence?
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BrotherRog Mod 4 Gle3nn • 6 years ago
We interpret Jesus' life and death differently. I don't subscribe to the substitutionary theory of the atonement, instead, I favor the moral influence theory. Peace.
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Kathleen Lipscomb
• 4 years ago
4 BrotherRog
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Are you related to Ragnarök?
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Jerry Lynch • 6 years ago
Here is something that you may appreciate; it came to me back in the mid-80s during my return to Christianity via Zen: Paradox is the native tongue of truth.
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Agni Ashwin > Jerry Lynch • 6 years ago
From Original Sin to Original Zen?
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The Mighty Damuramu (pka TOW) • 6 years ago
I wonder if Christians can't help but focus on the death of Jesus. They wear the symbol of his death around their necks, they adorn their homes and houses of worship with them. When they are surrounded by so much imagery of torture and execution, it's no wonder that it's what they focus on.
Mod > The Mighty Damuramu
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BrotherRog
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(pka TOW) • 5 years ago
.. though, that hasn't always been the case. The cross didn't really come to be the symbol for the faith until the 4th century. Prior to that, the fish was the symbol for those who follow Jesus.
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Frank Franklin TOW) • 6 years ago
> The Mighty Damuramu (pka
It's not the tail wagging the dog here.
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Peter Kupisz • 6 years ago
"This graphic depicts a polarized either/or perspective. It’s the sort of
non-spiritual, non-mystical, unrealistic, and dysfunctional mindset that
progressive Christianity seeks to help people place in the dustbin of
history"
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