조현 - 존카밧진 박사. 뉴욕에서 차로 세시간쯤...2311

(3) 조현 - 서양에서 명상을 뿌리내리게한 1세대 리더 매사추세츠 의과대 명예교수 존카밧진 박사. 뉴욕에서 차로 세시간쯤... | Facebook:

조현

Favourites  · dtoreposnSh0c1tgcu8u8uh8c077m1mgcl059i415ug516f9ah9la6u4h7gm  · 

서양에서 명상을 뿌리내리게한 1세대 리더 매사추세츠 의과대 명예교수 존카밧진 박사. 뉴욕에서 차로 세시간쯤 떨어진, 뉴욕과 보스턴 사이 노팅험이란 작고 아름다운 도시로 가, 그곳에서 사는 존 카밧진 박사가 소개한 작고 예쁜 동네호텔에 숙박했습니다. 호텔 다이닝룸을 빌러 대담할 자리와 카메라를 배치하고 기다렸는데 인터뷰를 시작하기로 한 오전11시가 되어도 나타나지않은 존.

마지막 메일을 주고받은게 1주일전인데, 혹 오늘 인터뷰가 있다는걸 잊어버렸나,날자를 착각했나, 어제 다시 확인 메일을 보냈어야했나. 이런 생각을 하던 찰라, 누군가 밖에 온 차에 내리는분이 존 카밧진 박사 같다고 해서 나가보니, 차에 탄 하얀머리에 마치 헬렌니어링 같은 인상의 할머니가 웃으며 손을 흔들었습니다.

미국의 역사를 백인 침략 지배자의 입장이 아니라 핍박받은 자들의 입장에서 쓴 <미국 민중사>를 쓴 하워드진의 딸. 존카밧진 박사의 아내였어요. 그가 운전한 차에서 내린 존박사는 다리를 절었어요. 전날 넘어져 다리를 다쳐 지팡이에 의지해왔어요. 이제 80이 되셨으니.

달라이라마 틱낫한 등과 함께 많은 일을 하고, 대담록도 내고, 미국에 명상바람을 일으킨 분답지않게 작은 백팩을 메고 온 존.

불편한 몸에도 애초 악속한 두시간을 훨씬 넘겨 무려 세시간반동안 너무도 열정적으로 대담에 응해줬습니다.

그가 MIT 재학시절 명상을 처음 만나고, 명상을 만나지않았으면 이미 청년시절 세상을 하직했을거란 이야기부터 진지하게 풀어냈어요.

저도 몇차례 뵙고, 20여년전 함께 금강산을 가기도했던 숭산스님이 존 결혼식 주례를 봤다는 소문이 사실이냐고 물었더니, 정말 그랬다더군요.

숭산스님의 주례로 숭산스님과 존부부, 도반 한명. 단 4명만 참여해 결혼식을 올렸다더군요.

그런 흥미로운 이야기뿐 아니라, 서양의 머리 좋고 열린 인물이 어떻게 불교의 진수를 구태의연한 논리가 아닌, 신선하고 명쾌하게 풀어내는지, 한국의 수행자들과 마음공부인들에게 많은 영감을 줄수있는 대화였습니다.

그가 창시한 MBSR(마음챙김에 기반한 스트레스 완화)은 하버드대, 스탠퍼드 의대등 세계 720여개 의료기관에서 활용될만큼, 그는 명상을 환자의 치유와 정신건강에 실제 활용하게한, 선구자이지요.

한국의 대표적인 인문학재단인 플라톤아카데미의 후원으로 진행한 존 카밧진 등 세계적인 명상인 및 심리학자들과 대담은 미국에서 돌아가는대로 부지런히 준비해, 조현TV휴심정과 플라톤아카데미 TV에 올려 애청자들과 함께 나누겠습니다.

All reactions:

389You, 허우성, 수지행자 and 386 others

27 comments

14 shares

Like

Comment

Share

Most relevant



수지행자

인터뷰 영상. 기다리겠습니다. 편안한 두 분 얼굴 보니 보는 사람도 좋네요.

• 11 h
• Like
• Reply

Kang-nam Oh

훌륭한 일 하셨네요. 기대됩니다. 무사 귀국 빕니다.

3

• 8 h
• Like
• Reply

박희승

훌륭하십니다!^&^

2

• 6 h
• Like
• Reply

오세욱

역시 기대됩니다~~

• 2 h
• Like
• Reply

민웅기  · 

Follow

MBSR의 창시자군요

• 1 h
• Like
• Reply

김명현

대단한 조현님! 역시 장하고도 장하십니다. 귀한일 잘 끝내고 무사히 귀국하시길요. 그리고 많은 사람들에게 선한 영향을 끼치기를 빕니다.

• 1 h
• Like
• Reply

마음쉼

우와아! 숭산스님이 주례를 해 주셨군요. 그리운 나의 스승님 ㅜ

• 6 h
• Like
• Reply

김연희

미국민중사를 쓴 아내가 대단하시네요.

카밧진박사의 MBSR 보급 열정도 그 인간애의 바탕에서 나왔겠구나 싶습니다.

수행의 감동적인 이야기들으며

얼마나 행복하셨을까요.

수고 많으셨습니다

명상문화보급 감사합니다.

• 10 h
• Like
• Reply

이창엽

김연희 미국민중사를 쓴 사람은 카밧진의 아내가 아니라 장인입니다.

조현 - 켄윌버 인터뷰를 하겠다고 나서면서 231122

(3) 조현 - 이번 미국행을 결심한것은 통합심리학의 대가 켄윌버가 인터뷰를 하겠다고 나서면서였습니다. 그가 불과 23세에... | Facebook

조현

Favourites  · oonpsrtSed9c627lt0ahat0762h2l6h19gglg73it57lui179901gfa0419g  · 

231122

이번 미국행을 결심한것은 통합심리학의 대가 켄윌버가 인터뷰를 하겠다고 나서면서였습니다. 그가 불과 23세에 <의식의 스펜트럼>(무경계)을 냈을때 서양에서는 플라톤 이래 가장 위대한 사상가, 의식분야의 아인슈타인이 나타났다고 찬사를 보냈지요.

잭 크리텐든 (애리조나주립대 교수)은 “21세기는 다음 세 명 중 한 명을 선택해야 할 기로에 놓여 있다: 아리스토텔레스냐, 니체냐, 아니면 켄 윌버냐.”고 했지요. 로버트 키건 (하버드대 교수)은
“켄 윌버는 국보다. 그처럼 심오한 정신과 마음으로 동양과 서양의 지혜를 통합한 사람은 없었다.”고 찬사를 보냈어요.

그는 이미 저서로서뿐만 아니라, 형형한 눈빛으로 수행자들을 사로잡았지요. 그의 저서로인해 미신적 신화적 몽환적 깨달음의 추구에서 벗어나 온전히 정신을 수습하기 시작한 수행자들, 종교인들이 적지않았으니, 그가 종교와 수행에 끼친 긍정적 영향은 두말할 나위가 없는 일이지요.
켄윌버는 록키산맥의 설산을 어디서나 쉽게 볼수있어, 영성가, 명상가들이 사랑하는 콜로라도 덴버에 살고있습니다.
고층빌딩이 드문, 덴버 다운타운의 아파트 맨위층 펜트하우스를 개인연구실 겸해서 살더군요.
집에 들어서자 마자 책이 수북이 쌓인 책상에 앉은 한 남자가 눈에 들어왔는데, 저분이 과연 켄윌버란 말인가. 믿기지않더군요. 웃으며 다가와 반기는 그를 보면서도, 그의 책 표지에 등장하는 강렬한 눈빛에 삭발한 청년의 이미지가 너무 강하게 박힌 탓인지, 장발이 흩날리고, 구부정한 모습의 노인이 그라곤 쉽게 알아보기 어려울 정도였지요.

그 집에선 비서 역할을 하며, 연구를 조력하는것으로 보이는 어시턴트가 세명가량 있었는데, 인터뷰를 돕는 남자 어시턴트는 켄윌버와 소통하려면 자기가 켄윌버의 귀에 입을 대고, 질문을 다시 설명해줘야할것이라며, 정상적인 소통이 어렵다는듯이 이야기하더군요.

아, 내가 너무 늦게 온것인가. 제대로 인터뷰도 할수없을말큼 켄윌버가 늙어버렸다는 말인가. 서양인들이 갑자기 늙는 경향이 있다지만, 75세면 그 정도까지 노쇠하지는 않았을것이라 예상했는데, 이 정도라니!

그의 많은 책을 읽으며, 질문을 준비했던 모든 노력이 허사가 되는건 아닌지 막막해지더군요.
그런데 이렇게 멀리 왔는데, 어찌됐건 인터뷰를 안할수는 없는 일이었습니다. 더구나 에스비에스가 명상 다큐멘터리를 준비하연서, 켄월버 인터뷰 내용의 일부를 담고싶어, 방송 카메라까지 보낸 상황이었지요.
그런데 인터뷰를 시작하자 놀라운 일이 일어났습니다. 켄윌버는 놀라운 집중력으로 질문 하나하나에 최선을 다해, 온 마음을 담아 답해주었습니다. 마치 자신의 비서의 우려를 비웃듯이 말이지요. 처음엔 마치 앤디 위홀처럼 수척한 그와 인터뷰다운 인터뷰를 하겠다는 기대는 접고, 한시간이나마 대담을 하면 다행이라 생각했는데, 그는 잠시도 한눈을 팔지않고, 거의 세시간 가까이 인터뷰를 했습니다.

제 첫질문.
"놀랍다. 당신은 그 비밀을 어떻게 알았냐?
깨달음을 얻었다는 사람들, 영적 체험을 했다는 사람들중 상당수가 완벽하기는커녕 인격적으로 문제가 많고, 성이나 돈 등에서 문제가 많으며, 영적 체험이 심리적 완성을 보장해주지않는다는것을 당신은 어떻게 이 연구실에 앉아서 알았는가. 난 수십년간 한국의 깊은 산에서 수행하는 수많은 스님과 수행자, 성직자들 뿐 아니라 히말라야, 인도, 네팔, 중국, 티베트, 일본, 베트남, 타이, 캄보디아, 라오스, 미얀마 등을 발이 부르트도록 돌아디니며 이른바 고승들을 수없이 만나보고야 알수있었는데 말이다."

이 질문부터 켄윌버는 신이 나서 이야기를 하기 시작했습니다.
귀국하면 켄윌버 인터뷰도 준비되는대로 조현TV휴심정과 플라톤아카데미TV에서 애청자들과 나누겠습니다.



Kang-nam Oh

아 다행입니다. 저도 오래 전 덴버에 학회가 있어 갔다가 전화번호부에서 전번을 찾아 전화했지만 결국 통화가 되지 않아 섭섭한 마음으로 돌아섰었는데 큰 일하셨네요. 조현tv 기대됩니다. 저는 그의 초기 책 Up from Eden을 교과서로 채택한 적이 있었지요.

The East Asian Region: Confucian Heritage... by Rozman, Gilbert

The East Asian Region: Confucian Heritage... by Rozman, Gilbert

https://archive.org/details/eastasianregionc0000unse_o8n5

Not available





The East Asian Region: Confucian Heritage and Its Modern Adaptation
by Gilbert Rozman (Editor)
2016, 1990

Hardcover
from $83.15
3 Used from $124.1113 New from $83.15
Paperback
from $41.00
2 Used from $54.547 New from $41.00

• The East Asian region in comparative perspective / Gilbert Rozman 
• -- The Chinese family and the spread of Confucian values / Patricia Ebrey 
• -- The Confucianization of Korean society / JaHyun Kim Haboush 
• -- The legacy of Confucianism in Japan / Martin Collcutt 
• -- Comparisons of modern Confucian values in China and Japan / Gilbert Rozman 
• -- Perceptions of Confucianism in twentieth-century Korea / Michael Robinson

The contributors to this volume range over 2,000 years of history as they show how Confucian values spread throughout the region in premodern times and how these values were transformed in an age of modernization. The introduction by Gilbert Rozman discusses the special character of East Asia. In Part I Patricia Ebrey analyzes the Confucianization of China; JaHyun Kim Haboush, that of Korea; and Martin Collcutt, the much later diffusion of Confucianism in Japan. In Part II Rozman compares types of Confucianism in nineteenth-century China and Japan and their adaptability in the twentieth century, while Michael Robinson adds an overview of modern Korean perceptions of Confucianism.

Originally published in 1990.

The Princeton Legacy Library uses the latest print-on-demand technology to again make available previously out-of-print books from the distinguished backlist of Princeton University Press. These editions preserve the original texts of these important books while presenting them in durable paperback and hardcover editions. The goal of the Princeton Legacy Library is to vastly increase access to the rich scholarly heritage found in the thousands of books published by Princeton University Press since its founding in 1905.
Read less

You Matter More Than You Think: Quantum Social Change for a Thriving World by Karen O'Brien

Amazon.com : you matter more than you think







You Matter More Than You Think: Quantum Social Change for a Thriving World
by Karen O'Brien , Tone Bjordam, et al. | Oct 13, 2021
4.7 out of 5 stars 23
Kindle Edition







You Matter More Than You Think: What a Woman Needs to Know about the Difference She Makes
by Leslie Parrott | May 26, 2009
4.5 out of 5 stars 55
Kindle Edition







You Matter More Than You Think: How to Live a Meaningful Life (Thought-Provoking Nonfiction)
Part of: Thought-Provoking Nonfiction (3 books) | by Phil M. Williams | May 1, 2023
4.6 out of 5 stars 18
Kindle Edition

====



Roll over image to zoom in

Read sample


Follow the author

Karen O'BrienKaren O'Brien
Follow

You Matter More Than You Think: Quantum Social Change for a Thriving World Kindle Edition
by Karen O'Brien (Author), Tone Bjordam (Illustrator), & 1 more Format: Kindle Edition

4.7 4.7 out of 5 stars 23 ratings

Kindle
from $9.99Read with our free app
Hardcover
from $30.14
4 Used from $30.145 New from $41.45

You Matter More Than You Think introduces a radically different way of thinking about climate change and social change. Inspired by ideas from quantum physics and quantum social science, quantum social change describes a conscious, nonlinear, and non-local approach to the transformations needed right now to address multiple global crises. It is grounded in our inherent oneness, recognizing that we are entangled through language, meaning, and shared contexts. This perspective on “mattering” shows us that our deepest values and intentions are powerful sources of individual change, collective change, and systems change and can generate a future where all life can thrive.

The book includes a Foreword by Dr. Christina Bethell and full-color original artwork by internationally-acclaimed artist Tone Bjordam.

KAREN O'BRIEN is a Professor of Human Geography at the University of Oslo and co-founder of cCHANGE. She was named by Web of Science as one of the world’s most influential researchers of the past decade in 2019 and 2020, and in 2021 she was a co-recipient of the BBVA Foundation's Frontiers of Knowledge award for climate change.

"You Matter More Than You Think is more than just a book. It is an awakening, a how-to manual showing a new path to social and ecological regeneration."
PAUL HAWKEN, author of Regeneration, Ending the Climate Crisis in One Generation.

“This book offers us a new way of looking at – and then moving towards – the transformational social change we know we need for the future we keep saying we want.”
HEIDE HACKMANN, CEO, International Science Council

"Karen O'Brien invites us to rethink what it means to be a living, thinking agent in our hyper-complex and troubled world. It's a hopeful book about our capacity to enact progressive change in the face of global challenges.”
NOEL CASTREE, University of Manchester, England

“Karen has artfully captured both the science and the soul, the seen and the unseen, the pragmatics and the poetics midwifing a new way of receiving and giving, which requires practice and more practice. The book is a great resource for scholars-practitioners, leaders, coaches, parents, educators, and anyone who holds questions and who is genuinely and humbly wanting to contribute to shift humanity’s story and make a positive difference.”
INA GJIKONDI, Director of Education and Coaching, The George Washington University

“This remarkable book’s message that we can all make a meaningful difference is needed more than ever after years of missed opportunities for climate and biodiversity policy. It is an important contribution to the efforts of dedicated people around the world doing all they can to achieve real social and cultural change for the long-term good of the earth and all its denizens.”
STEVEN HARTMAN, Executive Director, BRIDGES Sustainability Science Coalition in the UNESCO Management of Social Transformations Programme

‘’Karen O’Brien explains in a readable and yet theoretically persuasive way why quantum onto-epistemologies offer possibilities for thinking differently about how the universe is made, how we inhabit the world, and how we can change it. The book beautifully bridges the divide between theory and praxis … it constitutes an innovative way to make quantum count for changing the world.’'
LAURA ZANOTTI Virginia Tech University and Author of Ontological Entanglements, Agency and Ethics in International Relations
Read less



Print length

194 pages
Editorial Reviews

About the Author
Karen O'Brien is a Professor in the Department of Sociology and Human Geography at the University of Oslo, Norway. She is co-founder of cCHANGE, an organization that links research with action for with transformations to sustainability. Karen was named by Web of Science as one of the world's most influential researchers of the past decade in 2019 and 2020. In 2021 she was co-recipient of the BBVA Foundations Frontiers of Knowledge Award for Climate Change.

Christina Bethell is Professor of Public Health and Human Development in the Bloomberg School of Public Health at Johns Hopkins University. For the past 35 years she has built her work and career around an intentional goal to catalyze health care and public health transformation at the policy, systems and practice levels.

Tone Bjordam is a Norwegian artist who specializes in projects related to nature, perceptions, and science. She works with video, animation films, nature photography, abstract and nature-inspired paintings, intricate, detailed drawings, and sculpture installations. Tone is passionate about finding ways to communicate science through art. --This text refers to the hardcover edition.

Product details
ASIN ‏ : ‎ B09H3NN8ZC
Publisher ‏ : ‎ cCHANGE Press (October 13, 2021)
Publication date ‏ : ‎ October 13, 2021
Language ‏ : ‎ English
File size ‏ : ‎ 13480 KB
Text-to-Speech ‏ : ‎ Enabled
Screen Reader ‏ : ‎ Supported
Enhanced typesetting ‏ : ‎ Enabled
X-Ray ‏ : ‎ Not Enabled
Word Wise ‏ : ‎ Enabled
Sticky notes ‏ : ‎ On Kindle Scribe
Print length ‏ : ‎ 194 pages
Page numbers source ISBN ‏ : ‎ 8269181935Best Sellers Rank: #756,496 in Kindle Store (See Top 100 in Kindle Store)#143 in Human Geography (Kindle Store)
#995 in Climatology
#1,259 in Human Geography (Books)Customer Reviews:
4.7 4.7 out of 5 stars 23 ratings


Top reviews

Top reviews from the United States


Bichara Sahely
5.0 out of 5 stars A quantum leap to catalytic transformation of us AllReviewed in the United States on May 23, 2023
Verified Purchase
This is a must-read. It provides a roadmap from a degenerative fragmentary view of reality to a regenerative holofractactal one based on diversity, mutuality, harmony, and unity that would resonate with you through and through to be the change of good you want to be and become in this world.



HelpfulReport

Brian Eddy
5.0 out of 5 stars A MUST READ A major shift in thinking and realizing who and what we are!Reviewed in the United States on December 3, 2021
Verified Purchase
There has been much research and writing in recent years on how discoveries in quantum science have have radically changed our way of seeing ourselves, the universe and the world we live in. As an avid reader of the subject, I have yet to see a synthesis like the one Karen O'Brien has put together in "You Matter More Than You Think". This is not just more 'interesting stuff' for Sunday afternoon reading - it is 'essential' reading for us to embrace a very different way of understanding ourselves, both individually and collectively, and how we can shift to navigating this rapidly changing world with greater hope and realistic optimism.

3 people found this helpful


HelpfulReport

lontheroad
5.0 out of 5 stars Finally - A Handbook on Climate Change Where Hope and Science Meet.Reviewed in the United States on January 7, 2022
Verified Purchase
This beautifully written and illustrated book is the gentle yet powerful guidebook to real climate action we have all been waiting for. In ten short chapters, Karen O'Brien has given each of us the understanding, the plan, the confidence and the agency to enact real change globally and locally by simply rethinking our beliefs, telling our story, and making our unique yet impactful small step toward a better future. Get this book. Refer to it often. Share it with friends.

One person found this helpful


HelpfulReport

po
5.0 out of 5 stars understand how quantum theories can help change human culture for sustainable evolution.Reviewed in the United States on February 20, 2022
Verified Purchase
this book is easy to read and understand how quantum theories can open our minds to more creative solutions for evolving human culture in ways that support all other life and the planet. By encouraging more inclusive beliefs about the importance of the interaction of every living entity, humanity can address global climate change and social issues in new ways, starting with our own thoughts and intentions and actions.



HelpfulReport

Karen F.
5.0 out of 5 stars Must readReviewed in the United States on April 21, 2022
Verified Purchase
This book was eye opening and compelling. Definitely a driver for change both in the personal and social spheres. Thank you Karen O’Brien for bringing up quantum principles in such a clear and accessible way. This book has changed my perspective about being-in-action in this world.

One person found this helpful


HelpfulReport

Amazon Customer
4.0 out of 5 stars Thought-Provoking and EmpoweringReviewed in the United States on December 4, 2021

All of the big problems (and big solutions) are fueled by the daily choices of individuals. Yet while we want to make a positive difference in the world but we often think that we're just one person, that we can't make a difference. Classical, conventional ways of thinking and seeing the world perpetuates this paralysis. I've read many books about understanding the problems and opportunities facing society, but this is one of very few that focuses on the difference that the individual does and can make. O'Brien uses the lens and language of quantum physics, in accessible ways, to show that "we matter". The specific context is climate change, but the idea really applies to all kinds of issues that we face together. I highly recommend this book.



HelpfulReport

See more reviews


Top reviews from other countries

VAN ONSEM DIRK
5.0 out of 5 stars Inspire yourself to make a difference in climate actionReviewed in the Netherlands on January 31, 2023
Verified Purchase

Prof O'Brien makes us realize we all matter in the fight against climate change. She helps you explore very deep insights from the intersection between Quantum Theory and Social Science and in a very clear concise way connect with your capacity to drive change
Report
See more reviews


===

===