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Thoughts on Fire by Dr. Frank McCluskey - Ebook | Scribd 2004

Thoughts on Fire by Dr. Frank McCluskey - Ebook | Scribd

Ebook249 pages4 hours
Thoughts on Fire: Life Lessons of a Volunteer Firefighter


By Dr. Frank McCluskey
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About this ebook
They can walk through fire. They would sacrifice their own lives to save yours.


In the tradition of Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, Thoughts on Fire is a meditation on how to live a life that matters. Drawing on his dual life as a philosophy professor and firefighter, "Dr. Frank" begins a journey not just into the fire, but inside himself. The lessons of this voyage are not just about axes and hoses but hope, forgiveness and love.


"As a professor and a firefighter, Dr. McCluskey shifts gears easily between the metaphysical and the macho, pontificating in a pin striped suit by day and plunging into a smoky, flaming house by night."


-The New York Times


"It is a book that you will want to read again and again. It is a remarkable story that you will want to share with those you love."


-Dr. Robert Schachat, author of The Seven Conditions of Trust


"Thoughts on Fire is a book that is at once entertaining and enlightening"


-Dr. John Briggs, author of The Seven Life Lessons of Chaos
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LanguageEnglish
PublisheriUniverse
Release dateJan 4, 2004



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Thoughts on Fire: Life Lessons of a Volunteer Firefighter Hardcover – January 4, 2004
by Frank Bryce McCluskey Dr PhD (Author)
4.9 4.9 out of 5 stars    23 ratings
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They can walk through fire. They would sacrifice their own lives to save yours.
In the tradition of Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, Thoughts on Fire is a meditation on how to live a life that matters. Drawing on his dual life as a philosophy professor and firefighter, "Dr. Frank" begins a journey not just into the fire, but inside himself. The lessons of this voyage are not just about axes and hoses but hope, forgiveness and love.

"As a professor and a firefighter, Dr. McCluskey shifts gears easily between the metaphysical and the macho, pontificating in a pin striped suit by day and plunging into a smoky, flaming house by night."

-The New York Times

"It is a book that you will want to read again and again. It is a remarkable story that you will want to share with those you love."

-Dr. Robert Schachat, author of The Seven Conditions of Trust

"Thoughts on Fire is a book that is at once entertaining and enlightening"

-Dr. John Briggs, author of The Seven Life Lessons of Chaos

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From the United States
Amazon Customer
5.0 out of 5 stars Good Read!
Reviewed in the United States on January 21, 2021
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Good read even if your not a firefighter.
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Joseph Macchiarulo
5.0 out of 5 stars A Must Read
Reviewed in the United States on October 17, 2003
Verified Purchase
"Thoughts On Fire" is a very unique book that tells about a lot more than fire fighting. It is a book about life, filled with wisdom and inspriring thoughts that anyone can benefit from. Unlike many inspirational or "Spiritual" books about life, this book makes the great teachings REAL by communicating these teachings through real-life events and circumstances. I have read many books of this type; and "Thoughts On Fire" has touched my heart, moved my soul, and challenged my thinking and outlook on life more than anything I've found. This book is a MUST READ for anyone who is willing to look at things differently and gain the priceless benefits of a new outlook on life.
5 people found this helpful
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firefiteb
5.0 out of 5 stars Best volunteer firefighter book I've read
Reviewed in the United States on October 10, 2017
Verified Purchase
In my opinion, this book sets the bar for what volunteer firefighters deal with . you get the true feelings of being in small town USA..
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Sean Burke
5.0 out of 5 stars A must have for every fire fighter
Reviewed in the United States on March 5, 2013
Verified Purchase
From the new fire fighter in the house to a season pro this book is a great read for all.
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woodytaylor
5.0 out of 5 stars Five Stars
Reviewed in the United States on February 2, 2015
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A moving and thought provoking book
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Jane S. Bishop
5.0 out of 5 stars Thoughts on Fire paperback book
Reviewed in the United States on September 24, 2007
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This is a good book on Volunteer Firefighters. My husband chuckled everytime he read an anecdote that reminded him of his volunteer fire department over the last 25 years.
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Kenneth
5.0 out of 5 stars A Great Dichotomy
Reviewed in the United States on April 19, 2021
The author does a good job at highlighting the differences between his "working" profession and his experiences as a firefighter, while also emphasizing the overlaps they share. Overall a great book for anyone interested in the experience of a volunteer firefighter and/or anyone who loves philosophy.
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R. T. Lull
5.0 out of 5 stars Cerebral tales of firefighting
Reviewed in the United States on February 21, 2011
Most of the time, when you see "Doctor" appended to a firefighter's name, you assume that he took his EMT certification all the way through to an actual medical practice. Doc McCluskey, however, is a Doctor of Philosophy, and presents a unique perspective on the experiences of a volunteer firefighter. From his early attempts simply to fit in and not be discovered as an academic among working men, through to the twilight of his active career as a department officer, his tales of his experiences are well told, and present learning situations of all sorts. Some people may have to get past his philosophical analysis of some situations, but I found that he had a great ability to set up a story, with details when they mattered, and vagaries when they didn't. I especially appreciated the colorful cast of characters that he recalled with fondness and detail, while admitting in the prologue that he left out many more in the interest of simplicity. I am currently a rookie volunteer, and found his early insights especially valuable (and eerily similar to some of my own); I look forward to re-reading this book in a few years and seeing how much more I can learn from him then.
3 people found this helpful
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Gene Linfante
5.0 out of 5 stars A journey into the lives of small-town firefighters.
Reviewed in the United States on August 1, 2002
Thoughts on Fire gives us a glimpse into the mind of a philosophy professor turned firefighter. At the start of each chapter "Dr. Frank" relates the ideas of classic philosophy to our modern lives. Then suddenly, the fire bells sound and we're whisked off with sirens screaming, down rural highways and small-town streets, to the scene of a deadly blaze. But it's not until we get inside the steamy furnace that was once a neighbor's home and come face-to-face with the flames that can take away life that we begin to understand the secrets the author is trying to reveal. This book is thought provoking, moving and often funny. It's an uplifting story about friendship and trust, as well as community and courage. And in the end I think we learn that maybe the greatest teacher about life is life itself.
12 people found this helpful
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Jim Amy
5.0 out of 5 stars A Great Book
Reviewed in the United States on March 12, 2004
I highly recommend Dr. Frank's book as it shows us so adroitly how each of us can gain wisdom and love for our fellow man through service to our community. It is also a great tribute to the firefighters and EMTs across the country who keep us safe every day and night (with no holidays off). I would expect that the average firefighter, if there is such a thing, is not likely to write a book about his experiences. Dr. Frank, an outsider like ourselves when he joins their ranks, carries us into their world and helps us see what these amazing people do and why they do it.
4 people found this helpful
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Michael Pellet
5.0 out of 5 stars Excellent Book
Reviewed in the United States on July 17, 2004
This is a great book, I live about 15 miles from his volunteer Fire house, and I am a volunteer fire fighter myself. I just became a volunteer about 2 months ago, and so far my fire house and his seem very a like. This book, lets the world know what goes on in a small town volunteer fire departments like my own. Perfect book, describes everything in great detail, and is a great read, I could not put it down.
4 people found this helpful
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소방관이 된 철학교수 
프랭크 맥클러스키 (지은이),이종철 (옮긴이)북섬2007-06-29원제 : Thoughts on Fire (2002년)

293쪽

책소개

뉴욕 머시 대학에서 철학교수로 근무하는 프랭크 맥클러스키 박사는 30대 중반, 어느 날, 자원 소방관으로서 마호팩 펄스 소방서에서 일하기 시작한다. 일상의 탈출구로서 누구는 스카이다이빙을 시작하고, 누구는 산악자전거를 타기 시작하는 것처럼 그는 그저 불을 끄고 사람들을 구하는 일에 뛰어든 것뿐이다.

그렇게 12년의 세월을 보낸 끝에 그는 소방위(소방관 계급), 소방경(소방관 계급)을 거쳐 마침내 소방서장으로까지 진급하는 영광을 안는다. 이 책은 그렇게 삶과 죽음의 경계에서 그가 온몸으로 체득한 지혜와 통찰 끝에 탄생하였다.

화재 현장이라는 극단적인 상황에서 그가 찾아낸 여러 삶의 지혜는 결코 쉽게 얻을 수 없는 위대한 가치를 지닌다. 고고한 철학박사라는 사실이 믿어지지 않을 만큼 인간적이며 솔직하고 위트가 넘치는 저자의 필력에서 독자는 비록 심각한 상황에서라도 숨이 넘어가게 웃지 않을 수 없다.
목차
서문
감사의 글

가르침 - 어디에나 가르침은 있다
준비 - 지금 이 자리에서 만족하라
도착 - 인생을 새롭게 바꿀 기회를 얻다
배움 - 처음 불 속으로 굴러들어간 순간
사소한 것에 주목하기 - 눈앞의 일에 초점을 맞추어라
영웅 - 영웅이 되는 천 가지 방법
꿈 - 현실은 가장 아름다운 꿈이다
탄생 - 우린 매일 새로 태어난다
이직 - 인생의 갈림길에서 선택하기
차이 - 사람을 판단하는 방법
용기 - 찰나에 반짝이는 힘, 용기
주기 - 줄수록 행복해지는 선물
스타일 - 위기를 넘기는 힘, 스타일
죽음 - 매순간이 소중하다
전통 - 전통과 더불어 사는 법
공포 - 고소공포증을 치유한 소방관
완벽 - 완벽하지 않아도 좋다
백조 - 살아 있는 모든 것에 경배를!
빛 - 마침내 어둠 속에서 걸어 나오다
나이 들기 - 즐겁게 나이 들기
행복 - 사소한 것들에 행복이 있다
신뢰 - 신뢰는 마지막에 오는 손님이다
여행의 끝 - 마침내 집으로 돌아오다

후기
역자의 글

접기
책속에서
철학을 연구하는 일과 소방 활동을 하는 일은 의외로 비슷하다. 둘 다 끊임없이 생각하며 질문을 던져야 한다. 둘 다 아무것도 놓치지 않았음을 확신하기 전까지는 아무리 사소한 것이라도 신중하게 재검토해야 한다. 둘 다 어떤 것도 가정하고 넘어가서는 안 된다. -본문 17p 중에서
안쪽에 들어간 토니를 따라 우리도 들어가 호스를 가지고 그를 도와야 했다. 하지만 뜨거운 열기와 혼돈 속에서 잠깐 나는 머뭇거렸다. 그때 갑자기 날카로운 고통을 느꼈다. 그리고 뒤에서 가해진 힘에 의해 앞으로 밀려갔다. 즉, 멋지게 엉덩이를 걷어차인 것이었다. 월트의 신경질적인 목소리가 또렷하게 들렸다. '다음 주가 아니야. 바로 지금이야!' 월트가 그렇게 적시킥을 날려서 내 용기를 북돋아 주었고, 그렇게 불 속에 들어간 후 나는 별안간 불이 좋아졌다. -본문 54~57p 중에서  접기
번쩍거리는 소방차는 깨끗하게 닦인 선사(禪寺)의 모습과도 같다. 나도 처음엔 월트와 다른 소방관들이 그렇게 열심히 소방차를 관리하는 것을 이해하지 못했다. 그들은 그렇게 소방차에 전념함으로써 어려움을 잊는 것이다. 그것이 전통과 기율의 한 부분이 된다. 단절되지 않은 업무 사슬의 한 고리가 됨으로써, 그들은 더욱 단순하게 그들 자신이 되는 것이다. 소방장비가 불결하다는 것은 부주의한 내면을 반영한다. -본문 69p 중에서  접기
추천글
저 죽는 것도 모르고 불 속을 빠져드는 불나비가 본 불의 매혹 같은 책이다. 각 장마다 녹아 있는 삶의 지혜는 정녕 타오르는 불 속에 들어가 본 사람만이 알 수 잇는 귀중한 것들이다. 이 책은 그 어떤 고전이나 영화보다 감동적인 진실의 울림을 전해 준다. - 이주향 (수원대학교 철학과 교수) 
저자 및 역자소개
프랭크 맥클러스키 (Frank B. McCluskey) (지은이) 
저자파일
 
신간알리미 신청
미국 New School for Social Research의 대학원에서 독일 철학으로 철학박사 학위를 받았다. 예일 대학의 독불 실존주의 분과에서 국가 지원을 받아 인문학 박사 후 과정을 마쳤다. 1988년 마호팩 펄스 자원 소방서에 들어갔고 소방위, 소방경을 거쳐 소방서장까지 올라갔으며 1990년에는 마호팩 펄스 자원 소방서의 '올해의 소방관'에 뽑히기도 했다.

2007년 현재 뉴욕 머시 대학의 철학과 종교 분야의 정교수로 재직 중이며, 머시 대학 온라인 캠퍼스의 학장을 맡고 있다. 또한 뉴욕 주 소방관 연합회와 풋남 지역 책임자 연합회 및 국제 소방 책임자 연합회의 회원으로 활동 중이다.

한나 아렌트, 알랭 블룸, 칼 오토 아펠, B.F 스키너, 데이비드 봄 그리고 크리슈나무르티같은 사상가들과 함께 연구하고 대화를 나누었으며 조안 런든, 데이브 배리와 함께 텔레비전에 출연한 바 있다. 8년 동안 뉴욕시 지구에서 선(禪) 명상을 수행하기도 했다. 접기
최근작 : <소방관이 된 철학교수> … 총 2종 (모두보기)
이종철 (옮긴이) 
저자파일
 
신간알리미 신청
연세대 법학과를 졸업한 후 동 대학원 철학과에서 석사와 박사학위를 받았다. 연세대, 교원대, 숙명여대, 서울여대 등에서 강의했고, 몽골 후레 정보통신대학 한국어과 교수와 한국학연구소장을 역임하고, 한남대 초빙교수를 마지막으로 은퇴했다. 현재 연세대 인문학연구소 전임연구원으로 재직하면서 ‘브레이크 뉴스’와 ‘내외신문’ 컬럼리스트와 NGO 환경단체인 ‘푸른아시아’의 홍보대사를 맡고 있고, 네이버 프레미엄 서비스에 정기적으로 기고를 하고 있다. 지난 수년 동안 ‘에세이철학’을 철학의 독립 장르로 만들기 위한 글들을 지속적으로 발표하고 있다.
저서로 『철학과 비판-에세이 철학의 부활을 위해』가 있고, 공저로 『철학자의 서재』, 『삐뚤빼뚤 철학하기』, 『우리와 헤겔철학』, 『문명의 위기를 넘어』 등이 있으며, J. 이뽈리뜨의 『헤겔의 정신현상학』(1/공역, 2), A. 아인슈타인의 『나의 노년의 기록들』, S. 홀게이트의 『정신현상학 입문』, G. 루카치의 『사회적 존재의 존재론Ⅰ,Ⅱ』(2, 3, 4/공역), 『무엇이 법을 만드는가』(공역) 외 다수의 책들을 옮겼다. 접기
최근작 : <일상이 철학이다>,<철학과 비판> … 총 12종 (모두보기)

평점 분포
    8.4
     
좋은 책 감사합니다^^  구매
jumping6269 2010-04-02 공감 (1) 댓글 (0)
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즐겁게 읽다보면 자연스레 아! 하며 느낄 수있는 책  구매
들꽃성달 2010-04-22 공감 (0) 댓글 (0)
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마이리뷰
구매자 (2)
전체 (19)
리뷰쓰기
공감순 
     
길을 잃은 모든 이들에게 보내는 에세이 새창으로 보기 구매

이 책의 저자 프랭크 맥클러스키는 철학과 교수다. 그는 그 곳에서 고대 그리스 철학을 가르쳤다. 그 시대의 철학은 이 세계를 유지하기 위해 우리가 가져야할 덕목이 무엇인지 묻는 것이었다. 

논리적으로 다듬어진 답들은 교과서에 빼곡히 적혀 있지만 아무래도 피부에 와 닿지는 않는다. 희생과 용기를 이해하는 건 머리지만 차도로 뛰어드는 아이를 가로채는 건  두 팔과 다리이기 때문이다. 그래서 보통의 철학 교수라면 누구나 앎과 실천을 통일하고픈 욕망에 사로잡히곤 한다. 그렇게만 된다면 강의는 압도적인 위엄을 갖추게 될뿐만 아니라 지역사회의 존경을 받는 위대한 시민이 될 수 있기 때문이다. 철학교수가 소방관이 된데는 아마도 이런 계산이 깔려 있었을 것이다.

실제로 미국에서 Fireman이라고 하면 엄청난 존경을 받는다고 한다. 아이들은 크롬 도금으로 번쩍이는 소방차를 보면 오줌을 지릴 정도로 흥분한다. 그래서인지 의용소방대원이라는 것이 끊이지 않고 모집되는 모양이다. 

의용소방대란 자원봉사의 성격이 짙지만 지자체의 보조금과 각종 기부금을 받아 월급, 보험가입, 교육 심지어 퇴직금까지 지급하는 일종의 정부 기관이라고 볼 수 있다. 물론 이 곳의 구성원들은 월급과 퇴직금을 바라고 모여든 사람들은 아니다. 그들은 엄연히 생업을 가지고 있으며 자신을 희생하는 대가로 위험한 삶을 넘겨받은 고귀한 시민들이다. 미국의 경우 1,148,850명의 소방관 중(2008년 기준) 무려 72%에 달하는 827,150명이 이렇게 바보같은 거래를 한 사람들이라고 한다. 


 

 

 <출처: Flickr,  ricardomakyn> 

 

길에서 만나면 평범하고 온순해 보이는 사람들이 뒤도 돌아보지 않고 이글거리는 불 속으로 뛰어드는 이유가 뭘까? 그저 어릴적 추억을 잊지 못하는 어른들의 로망인 걸까? 아니면 Xsports마저 싫증난 사람들의 철없는 취미인 걸까? 마호팩 펄스의 소방대원들은 거의 대부분이 마호팩 펄스 출신의 부모나 형제를 가진 사람들이었다. 그들은 아주 어려서부터 불 냄새를 맡으며 자라왔고 문득 정신을 차려보니 어느 순간 Fireman이 되어 있었다. 이건 의무나 사명과는 느낌이 다르다. 그들은 그저 되야할 것이 된 것 뿐이다.

프랭크 맥클러스키 또한 이런 운명에따라 마호팩 펄스의 소방서에 발을 디뎠다. 머시 대학의 철학 교수는 결코 지식과 실천을 통합하기 위해서라든가 존경받는 아버지, 용감한 시민이 되기 위해 Fireman을 선택한 것이 아니었다. 그는 '그냥' 소방관이 됐고 출동한 화재 현장에서 주변의 모든 것들을 무로 돌리는 오렌지 빛 신에 완전히 사로잡혔다.

그런데 그 순간 프랭크 맥클러스키는는 자신이 왜 그 자리에 서 있어야 하는지 깨달았다. 여지껏 살아왔던 모든 시간들이 바로 그 화재 현장으로 빨려들고 있었다.

출동을 마치고 돌아온 소방관들은 여느때처럼 농담을 주고 받으며 피자를 먹고 맥주를 마셨다. 소방서 뒤뜰의 잔디밭에는 따스한 햇빛이 비추고 있었다. 그는 그 속에 섞여 조용히 울려오는 가슴의 소리를 들었다. 그 소리는 자신이 왜 소방관이 됐는지를 말해주고 있었다. 

 

 

  

살다보면 때로 길을 잃는 경우가 있다. 내가 나일 수 있게 해주는 오래된 신념과 내가 진짜 바라는게 무엇인지 속삭여주던 마음의 소리가, 더이상 들리지 않는다. 대부분의 사람들은 이럴 때 시간을 멈춰두고 지난날을 돌아본다. 이 시간 여행 속에서 사람들은 올바른 길을 되찾을 때도 있지만, 오히려 더 캄캄한 미로 속에 갇히곤 한다. 탈출구를 찾아 이리저리 헤매보지만 문득 정신을 차려보면 어느새 제자리다. 어둠을 몰아내기 위해 피운
불빛은 어느새 어둠의 일부가 된다. 애타게 기다려 보지만, 잊혀진 소리는 쉽게 돌아오지 않는다.

저자는 머리말에 이 책을 '고향으로 가는 여행에 관한 이야기'라고 썼다. 본문 중에는 '우리 모두는 올바른 길을 알기 어려운 인생에서 전기를 맞게 된다'라고도 썼다. 길을 잃고 괴로워하는 사람들에게, 이 책은 큰 힘이 될 것이다.

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한깨짱 2011-05-25 공감(2) 댓글(0)
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소방관이 된 철학교수 새창으로 보기
이 책은 너무 열심히 읽어버렸다. 그래서 조금씩 천천히 읽을꺼야, 라고 한 다짐도 금새 잊어버리고 후다닥 읽어버리고는 '아, 좋다' 라는 말 한마디를 남기고 까맣게 잊어버리고 있었다.
지금 돌이켜 떠올리면서 '그래, 뭐가 좋았는데?'라고 스스로에게 물어보고 있으려니 선뜻 대답이 나오지 않는다. '뭐야, 좋았다는 거 맞아?'

그래, 확실히 뭐라 뚜렷이 말하지는 못하겠지만 이 책은 상당히 맘에 들었다. 지금이라도 손만 뻗으면 집어 들수 있는 위치에 있는 책을 집어 들어 내용을 훑어보고 리뷰를 써도 되겠지만 그러지 않고 끝까지 내 느낌만으로만 책느낌을 적어볼까 한다. 무지 짧게.

철학교수 운운하지 않더라도, 어쩌면 우리가 이미 다 알고 있는 삶의 지혜에 대한 이야기이기 때문에 별다른 느낌이 없을수도 있다. 하지만 내가 이 책에 열광한 이유는 그것이다. 자신을 숨기지 않고 솔직히 드러내보이고 있기 때문이라는 것. 두려움도 부끄러움도 실수도.. 그 어떤 것도 과장없이, 변명도 없이 소방관의 삶에서 느끼는 수많은 삶의 지혜를 이야기 하고 있기때문이다.

내 앞에 뜨겁고 커다란 불꽃이 죽음을 위협하며 다가올 때, 나는 두려움을 극복하고 불길을 지나 새로운 시작을 위한 물줄기를 뿜어 낼 수 있을까, 생각해보게 되었다.
불과 마주한 순간 멈칫하던 프랭크는 단순히 엉덩이를 한 대 차이는 것으로, '바로 지금'이라는 이야기를 듣고 불속으로 뛰어들었다. 물론 엉덩이 한 대로, '바로 지금'이라는 말 한마디만으로 그가 처음 소방관으로서 출동해서 용감히 불길에 뛰어들 수 있었던 것은 아닐것이다. 그는 진정한 소방관이 되려고 했고, 그러기 위해 열심히 훈련을 받았고 준비를 했다. 하지만 실전에서 그 단계를 뛰어넘기 위해 필요한 뛰어듦의 용기는 그렇게 시작된 것이다.

나는 그런 그의 이야기들이 좋았다. 괜히 '철학교수' 어쩌구 하는 잘난척이 아닐까, 그저 그런 책이 아닐까 라는 편견을 누르게 된 것이 이 책을 더욱 기분좋게 읽은 또하나의 이유일지도 모르겠다. 

 
 
 행복은 당신이 가슴속에 무엇을 담고 사느냐이다. (261)

 
 
종교에 연연하지 않고 펄스 소방관이 잘 보이는 곳에 묻혀, 후대의 누군가가 기념일에 자신의 무덤에 깃발을 꽂아주리라는 믿음으로 살아가는 그는 행복할 것이다.

- 처음 알라딘 서평단에 신청한것도 까먹고 내게 보내져 온 책을 보면서 이건 뭐야? 라고 내뱉었던 내 편견의 한마디를 후회하면서도 술렁거리며 쓴 리뷰라 죄송합니다. 하지만 책은 좋았어요. 정말로. 내.게.는! 

 
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chika 2007-08-24 공감(2) 댓글(0)
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모든 순간이 꽃봉오리인 것을^^ 새창으로 보기
 그래, 이 시가 생각난다. '모든 순간이 꽃봉오리인 것을' 정현종의 시였었지 아마도. 왜 우리는 그 단순하고 명쾌한 사실을 자꾸만 잊고 그 꽃봉오리 꽃이 피지 않았다고 짜증만 내는지 모를 일이다. 꽃봉오리 역시 꽃이었음을 모르는 어리석은 우리들의 모습을 소방관이 된 철학교수가 다시 한 번 꼬집고 나서야 '아차' 외친다.

 사실 우리 나라에는 없는 자율 소방관이 되기 위해 혹은 되고 나서 훈련을 거치는 장면을 보고 "뭐야? 그래서 어쨌다는 거야? 옛날 텔레비전에서 주말마다 했었던 911 프로그램 내용이랑 다를 바가 없네! 그 911 프로그램에서 위급한 상황 속에서도 평정을 잃지 않고 구조에 몰두했던 사람들이 '정말 힘들었었죠. 그땐 제가 이렇게 누군가의 생명을 구하게 될 수 있으리라 생각하지 못했죠(웃음)'라고 했었잖아!"라고 중얼거리고 있었다. 그래서 책장도 더디게 넘겼다. 의무감이 아니었으면 이 책의 가치를 놓칠 뻔 했다.

 '불길의 한 가운데 있었던 사람은 사물을 바라보는 방식이 달라질 수밖에 없다'라고 말한 소방관이 된 철학교수. 그는 이제 철학을 머리가 아닌 가슴으로 이해하게 되었다. 그리고 그 가슴으로 이해하게 된 것을 조곤조곤 독자들에게 얘기하는 것이 이 책이 가진 매력이다. 예를 들어 아리스토텔레스의 용기에 대해 이렇게 얘기한다. '그렇다. 아리스토텔레스는 극소수가 깨닫는 진리를 알고 있었다. 그는 용기가 말이 아니라는 것을 알았다. 용기는 행동 속에 존재한다. 아리스토텔레스에게 있어 용기는 되도록 자주 실행하지 않으면 안 되는 실천적 가치이다. 서서히 그리고 조심스럽게 성장하는 습관이다. 아무데서나 갑자기 나타나지는 않는다. 평생토록 성의와 관심을 기울인 후에야 숙성되는 과일과 같은 것이다.' 이 구절이 손에 잡히지 않는 먼 산처럼 붕 떠 보이지 않고 가슴에 팍 와 닿는 이유는 붉은 불과 싸운 소방대원들과 이 책의 저자의 용기를 본 후에 나즈막히 철학교수의 목소리를 빌려 들려주었기 때문일 것이다.

 이 책은 '스타일'있는 책이다. 니체가 초인은 '스타일'을 갖는다고 했다지?(이 책의 철학교수가 그랬다.) 스타일이란 일상적인 것을 비상한 것으로, 평범한 날을 축제일로, 일상적 삶을 높은 수준으로 끌어올리는 요소이다. 결국 이 소방관 아니 이 철학교수는 스타일 있는 삶을 통해 우리에게 철학적인 삶, 성찰의 삶을 살 수 있도록 조언하는 것이리라.

 괜찮은 책이다. 부분부분 별로 마음에 들지 않은 쓸데없는 구절이라 느껴지기도 했지만 그것은 전체의 장점을 뛰어넘지 못한다. 심도 깊은 철학책을 원하는 것이 아니라 삶의 성찰의 계기가 필요할 때 읽으면 좋을 듯하다.   

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하늘닮은호수 2007-08-28 공감(2) 댓글(1)
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그들만의 유토피아, 마호팩 펄스 소방서 새창으로 보기
 
숨 가쁘게 꽉 짜여 진 하루일과 속에서,


무엇을 위해 그리 매순간을 질주하는 지도 모르며,


휴식이 필요해.. 전환이 필요해..하는 내부의 목소리를 들으면서도 모른 채


억누름이 어느덧 생활이 된 듯,


그런 찌 들린 일상에 작은 보상이라도 주어지면,


그저 만족하며, 스스로 안정된 삶을 살고 있다,, 미래를 위한 삶을 살고 있다며


그저 또 스스로를 자기체면에 도취시키며 살고 있는,


삶이란, 인생이란 커다란 명제 따위는


어느덧 먹고 사는 것과 별로 상관없다고 치부하며 등한시한지가 오래된 나와 같은 사람들이라면,


다시금 살아감의 의미를 프랭크박사와 함께


삶과 죽음이 생생하게 전해지는 이 책의 한 페이지 한 페이지를 안내자삼아


자아의 재정립, 삶의 의미라는 거창한 명제 따위는 제쳐두고라도 이 책에 한번 빠져 들어


봤으면 하는 게 읽고 난 후 제일 먼저 드는 생각이다.



물론, 시대를 불문하고 우리주변엔 우리에게 삶의 의미를 자각하게끔 하는 서적은 도처에


널려있다.

그러나 그 많은 책들 중에서도 이 책이 조금 더 괜찮다고 느낀 건

현재 철학박사로서 대학 강의를 하고 있는 저자가 자신의 귀중한 시간을 들여 동시에

자원봉사 소방관으로서의 경험을 통해 이웃과 함께하는 소박하고 따뜻한 삶의 표본을 제


시하는 진실성에 있는 것 같다.

이 책의 중심 공간인 마호팩 펄스 소방서, 그곳은 여러 직업을 가진 이들이 화재와 여러


위급 상황에 맞서서 사랑을 실천하며, 학력도 성별도 어떠한 차별도 없는 그들만의 유토


피아를 이뤄가는 소중한 공간이다.

평범한 대학교수가 그 소방서를 찾게 된 그날부터 그에게도

삶이란 머릿속에서만 그려내는 이론이 아닌,

적극적으로 행동해야 만하는 실천의 그것이 되며,

닫혀있던 인생이 교감하는 인생으로 전환되는 시점을 맞이하게 된다.


또한 이 책에서는 위에서 언급한 삶의 의미 찾기와 소방관으로서의 생생한 구조현장의 디


테일한 묘사 외에도, 저자의 철학교수로서의 지적인 면모가 매 장마다 여실히 드러난다.

일반인이 접근하기 어려운 니체의 실존주의철학이나, 플라톤의 제자인 아리스토텔레스가


말한 용기의 의미니 하는 것들이 저자의 현장경험과 함께 쉬운 이야기정도로 책 곳곳에


녹아 있으며, 간간히 저자가 들려주는 신화속이야기와 함께 이 책을 구성하는 기본 플롯


으로 알차게 자리 잡고 있다는 점이 책을 읽어가면서 눈길을 끌었던 부분이다.



이 책과의 만남은 책안에서 여유로운 느긋한 미소를 보이고 있는 저자만큼이나,

내 삶도 좀 더 적극적이고, 용기 있으며, 이웃에 대한 사랑을 싹틔울 수 있길 바랐던

그리고 정말 그렇게 하리라. 머릿속의 생각만이 아닌.. 언제나 행동하리라는

다짐을 가슴 안에 각인 시켰던 그런 소중한 시간이었던 것 같다.

옆집 아저씨가 들려주는 푸근한 이야기정도로 읽기에도 부담이 없고,

매 장마다 ‘불’에 관한 경험에 대한 저자의 짧은 메모는 어느 것 하나 인생에서 놓쳐서는

 요약본이 아닐까라는 생각을 해본다.
물론, 그것 또한 자신이 몸소 실천함으로서 자신만의 독트린으로 만들어가야겠지만..  
- 접기
나의모든시간 2007-08-16 공감(2) 댓글(1)
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공감
     
불의 세계라는 황홀경에 빠진 철학교수 새창으로 보기
편하게 교수나 하면서 살지 웬 소방관을 한다고 자처하고...

내 주위의 누군가가 그랬다면 도시락을 싸들고 다니면서 뜯어 말렸을지도 모른다. 우리나라나 외국이나 소방관이란 직업이 매력적이지만 위험하긴 매한가지니까...

10년이나 기다렸다가 결국 이루게 된 소방관.

불 속에 뛰어들어가 구해준 사람에게 영웅이 되진 못할 망정 괜한 시비로 어이없어지기도 하고, 생전 처음 앰뷸런스를 운전하고, 길가에서 산고의 고통에 시달리는 산모를 구하고, 발이 나무에 낀 개와 빙판에 낙상한 사슴도 구하며 서서히 소방관(구급대원)의 모습을 갖추게 된다.

「어느 위대한 사상가는 황금이 인간 영혼의 메타포라고 했다. 불의 열기는 불순한 것을 제거해서 오직 황금만을 남긴다. 영혼은 그 순수성을 보장하는 이러한 이행기를 통과하지 않으면 안된다. 성서의 말씀처럼, '황금은 고통의 용광로에서 탄생한다'」- P.46 中...

누가 철학교수 아니랄까봐, 그닥 친근하지도 않은 '사르트르'나 '아리스토텔레스'같은 학창시절 교과서 중심의 인물들이 쏟아져 나온다. 그들의 언어와 행동을 소방관으로써 갖게되는 의식과 연관을 시키면서 평범한 듯한 일상들에게 의미를 부여시킨다.

'철학'. 듣기만 해도 딱딱해지는 느낌은 왜 드는지 잘 모르겠다. 하지만, 철학교수 '프랭크'를 만남으로써 멋없고 재미없는 철학의 목소리를 조금은 느슨하고 부드럽게 받아들이는 중이다.

참된 나를 발견하기 위해 불 속으로 뛰어든 철학교수. 나를 발견하기 위해 내가 뛰어들어갈 곳은 어디인지 고민하게 된다.

- 접기
sonyonssi 2007-08-22 공감(1) 댓글(2)
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오구라 기조, 왜 한국인들은 극단적으로만 생각하는가? 이종철 2023

왜 한국인들은 극단적으로만 생각하는가?

by이종철Aug 19. 2023

https://brunch.co.kr/@35a0b96c4e334fd/7

Why Koreans? 6탄

교토 대학의 오구라 기조 교수는 일본내 대표적인 지한 학자로 알려져 있다. 수년 전 그는 <한국은 하나의 철학이다>(모시는 사람들, 2017)를 출간해서 센세이션을 일으킨 바가 있다. 조선이 '철학의 나라'라는 것은 잘 알려져 있지만, 이 조선에서 오직 하나의 리(理)를 둘러싼 싸움에서 승자 독식하는 현상을 밝힌 것이다. 이런 현상은 그 이후 현대에까지 이르러 오늘 날 한국사회를 지배하는 '진영논리'도 그런 현상을 대표하고 있다. 그는 <조선 사상사>(도서출판 길, 2021)라는 책에서 일본인의 사유방식과 한국인의 사유방식을 비교해서 두드러진 특징을 기술한다. 이러한 기술은 과거 루스 베네틱트가 <국화와 칼>이라는 책에서 일본인의 대표적인 특성으로서 한편으로는 평화를 상징하는 국화를, 다른 한편으로는 폭력성을 상징하는 사무라이의 칼로 상징한 것과 비슷하다.


오구라 기조는 한국인들의 가장 두드러진 사고는 '뒤집기'(개변)라고 보는 반면 일본인의 사고는 '브리꼴라쥬'라고 본다. 일본 문화가 외부로부터 도래하는 문화에 대해 브리콜라주(수선)적인 포섭 방법을 취하는 경향이 강한 반면, 조선은 외부로부터 도래한 사상이 기존 시스템의 전면적인 개변을 추진하는 경향이 존재한다는 것이다. 고려 시대에 불교가 주도 사상으로 사회 변혁을 시도했고, 조선에서는 주자학이 국가의 통치 이념이 되면서 사회를 혁명적으로 바꿨다. 근대에 기독교가 새로 들어오면서 그런 역할을 했고, 이런 전통은 현대에 들어서도 조선민주주의 인민공화국에서 공산주의라는 사상(주체사상)이 똑같은 역할을 하고 있다. 말하자면 한국은 사상이 연속성을 띄기 보다는 새로운 사상에 의해 끊임없이 대체되고 개변되고 있다는 것이다. 여기서는 오로지 하나를 쟁취하려는 싸움이 득세하고, 이 싸움에서 승리한 자가 모든 것을 차지한다. 그러다 보니 써움은 목숨을 건 사생결단 식으로 이루어질만큼 격렬해진다. 조선시대 사색당쟁에서 지면 삼족이 멸해지는 전통은 최근의 조국 집안을 도륙내는 검찰의 행태에서도 그대로 재현되고 있다.

이런 극단적인 뒤집기와 부정은 현대인의 한국인들에게도 거의 모든 부문에 걸쳐 드러난다. 진영논리가 일상화되면서 지역 간 갈등, 계층 간 갈등, 도능 간 갈등, 세대 간 갈등, 남여 간 갈등, 정규직과 비정규직 간 갈등, 진보와 보수 간 갈등 등 거의 전반에서 나타난다. 한국에서는 정권이 바뀌면 전 정권에서 했던 일 중에 아무리 좋은 일 조차 다 뒤집어 팽개치는 것을 너무나 당연시 한다. 최근 김훈 작가가 '내 새끼 지상주의'를 중앙일보에 싣자 기다렸다는 듯 온갖 비난과 증오를 내뱉는다. 구글이나 페이스 북에 보면 글 좀 쓴다는 사람들은 하나같이 입을 모아 김훈에 대해 저주하고 있다. 하지만 이것은 정도를 넘어도 한참 넘은 반응이다. 김훈 작가가 핵심으로 생각한 '내 새끼 지상주의'와 '공교육의 죽음'은 아예 관심도 갖지 않고, 오직 그가 조국 교수 부부를 소환한 단 두 줄이 문제삼기 때문이다. 사실 김훈의 이런 논지는 '생물학적 환원주의'에 빠졌을 뿐 아니라 공교육의 문제를 학부모의 민원으로 치부한 데서 심각한 인식의 한계를 보여주는 것이다. 이처럼 유리한 비판의 호재를 두고 반대세력들은 오로지 조국사수!의 투쟁 대열로 일사분란하게 움직이는 것이다. 이런 감정적인 반응의 정도가 심해지더니 개딸 등 강성 지지층은 드디어 과거 이문열의 책을 태웠던 악몽을 일깨우려는 듯 김씨의 책을 갖다 버리겠다고 선언했다. 한국과 같은 대표적인 문명 국가에서 도저히 있을 수 없는 일이 벌어지는 것이다.

한국 사회의 극단적 분열 상황에서 중도나 양비를 이야기하면 너무 쉽게 사이비나 회색분자로 매도된다. "양끝으로 떨어지지 말라"는 불락이변(不落二邊)은 불교의 중도 사상의 핵심이고, 중용은 유학의 오래된 경전의 이름이기도 하다. 오래 전 그리스의 아리스토텔레스도 <니코마코스 윤리학>에서 '중용'을 강조한 바 있다. 중용은 극단이 빚는 악덕, 이를테면 지나침과 모자람과 같은 악덕을 피하기 위한 중간의 논리이다. 하지만 이것은 단순한 산술적 의미의 중간이 아니라 실천적 이성의 지혜를 요구하는 논리이다. 무엇이 만용이고, 무엇이 비겁인 지는 때와 상황에 따라 얼마든지 달라질 수 있기 때문에 용기라는 중요의 덕을 단순하게 파악할 수 있는 것은 아니다. 때문에 그것은 삶의 쓰고 단 맛을 본 사람만이 깨달을 수 있는 통찰이다. 반면 극단적 사고는 쉽게 감정에 휘둘리는 이른바 초짜들의 행태라고 할 수 있다. 그들에게는 오로지 선명 투쟁 외에는 눈에 보이는 것이 없다. "너 죽고 나 살자"는 벼랑 끝 논리가 전부다. 그렇다면 한국인들은 오랜 고난의 역사를 경험했으면서도 여전히 그것을 삶의 지혜와 통찰로 끌어 올리지 못한 셈이다. 한국인들은 도대체 언제 쯤 철이 들 것인가?


Yoga As a Vehicle for Mental Health Care, With Chinmay Surpur


0:03 / 35:16
Yoga As a Vehicle for Mental Health Care, With Chinmay Surpur

Saybrook University
3.81K subscribers

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10 views  Oct 17, 2023  Unbound: Saybrook Insights Podcast
Chinmay Surpur was one of the first guests to appear on “UNBOUND: Saybrook Insights.” Surpur returns to the podcast to catch up with Dr. Long, 
  • discuss his experience at Saybrook as he enters the final stage of his doctoral program, and 
  • explain how yoga can support treatment for a variety of physical and mental ailments.

Surpur is a student in Saybrook University’s Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology program. He is also the director of research at Yoga Bharati, a nonprofit organization dedicated to enhancing health, happiness, knowledge, and peace through a holistic approach to yoga. 

Visit yogabharati.org to learn more.
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Transcript


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0:00
[Music]
0:11
hey everyone Nathan long here president of sa Brook University here in beautiful passadena we're actually in Oldtown
0:18
Pasadena it's so beautiful right now this time of year we're in Fall of 2023
0:23
the leaves are sort of changing color you know it's California you you get sort of the mix and match of that sun's
0:30
out beautiful weather it's that time of year where new students are coming into the university and continuing students
0:37
are coming back um and today's guest is one of our continuing students I can't tell you how excited I am to reconnect
0:44
with him nearly three years ago uh Chim my sorour was one of my first guests on
0:50
this podcast and it was at the peak of the pandemic really and I was inspired at the time by his passion and his Focus
0:56
around yoga uh especially his nonprofit yoga baroi um and we're going to check
1:02
in with him see how things have been going where he's at but also uh dig in a little bit deeper on the yoga side of
1:09
the equation um so that should be fun uh along with being very educational I
1:15
think you'll agree with me on that uh a brief bio in chimi uh chimi suore uh has
1:21
his master's degree and Bs in Neuroscience got his Masters at UC Santa
1:27
Barbara he's also the director of research at yoga barati he's a PhD
1:32
candidate in Clinical Psychology right here at sa Brook University doing fabulous work uh with his colleagues he
1:39
has worked on initiating completing and Publishing research studies at his Alma moer UC see Santa Barbara as well as at
1:47
yoga Bara and now at sa Brook University all right so let's get to it
1:53
with Mr chinmai soror Mr chinmai soror it is a pleasure to have you back here
2:00
on sa Brook insights after several years how are you today I'm doing wonderfully today Dr long and it's a as usual a
2:07
pleasure to talk to you as well likewise it was so good to see you live in person
2:12
a couple weeks ago and uh you you were bright shining excited which was
2:19
fabulous so two reasons for that one you've been in a doctoral program for a few years so you're like still happy
2:25
that's good number two you were like turning me on to all these really cool
2:30
uh things you were doing and a couple you know a new student that you were really impressed by I just really love
2:35
your energy so so good to have you back and see you back well there's a third there's a third you forgot about I I got
2:42
to see you well that Lit me up thank you that I appreciate that very much that's that's
2:49
awesome so um I want to hear about um a few things about what you've been doing
2:54
since then but I think to sort of rewind for our guests you know you were one of our highest downloaded episodes of all
3:02
time for the record really yeah I think people really enjoyed hearing you so maybe for our audience tell us a little
3:08
bit about you before sa Brook so how did you find your way uh through life before
3:13
you came to grad school uh at sa Brook University I think for a long very long
3:19
time I was looking for my place I was always looking for uh since I was a kid
3:24
I mean since I was quite young I remember my mom telling me you seem to never really fit F in with the group
3:30
that you're supposed to fit in with like you know your age group your grade your um your community like the this the
3:37
social group that you're in like why is that right and then we'd kind of like you know talk a lot about that and I was
3:42
always kind of into things like language literature philosophy a lot more at a at a younger age um and as I was getting
3:50
older I mean a big part of my life was service it was uh being a part being a
3:56
part of community and serving community so a lot of that I mean in in my circles in my age group it just wasn't really
4:03
there it wasn't really that present um and I always found myself kind of looking up to older folks uh a lot more
4:10
um and the kind of work that they were doing so uh when I finished my undergraduate education at the
4:15
University of California Santa Barbara um in in biopsychology I think they changed it to Neuroscience now um I
4:23
started to get more into the nonprofit world uh especially within the field of yoga uh which is again another unique
4:30
sort of thing uh to get into professionally primarily into like research uh into public Outreach so I
4:37
was traveling to different countries um and the plan was really to be um
4:42
traveling across the globe uh meeting with various populations various individuals um leaders of various
4:49
communities to sort of uh educate them and engage in a sort of cultural
4:55
exchange about how yoga and uh indigenous forms of healing can be
5:00
beneficial towards uh just maintaining and promoting Health whether that's
5:05
preventative health or uh I mean what what we have a lot of in this country is reactionary Health Care um how it can
5:12
kind of fit in there right um and then as the pandemic sort of started uh it
5:18
just shut down my whole travel thing um and I I was just kind of forced to do a lot of what I was doing remotely and it
5:25
was around the same time that I was coming into you know I always knew I wanted to get into research always knew
5:30
I wanted to do a PhD and always had a sense that it was going to be in within the field of psychology so um just the
5:36
sort of like combination of my public facing sort of work that I was always into um the sense that I had with people
5:44
just communicating with people um you know eliciting change in a positive way
5:49
of course um that that just kind of brought me into looking at a PhD in Clinical Psychology and then
5:57
specifically sa Brook I found the uh the values of sa Brook I mean I'd heard about you guys from a couple of other
6:03
individuals um another faculty I think an adjunct faculty that you guys had a while ago Dr Prasad gipa and he uh
6:11
recommended that uh I should join saber because of the work that I was doing um and I was looking into sa Brook and I
6:16
found just the vision the mission it was just so beautiful and uh very much in alignment with how I was seeing the
6:22
world so um kind of coming into entering the uh the environment the ethos of sa
6:28
Brook I felt very much like I found that community that I was that I was always looking for uh granted you know we are
6:36
all we're we're not in person we're remote um you know we don't get to necessarily see each other as often as
6:42
uh other maybe brick and mortar universities do uh but but I really valued the the the global sort of um
6:49
perspective that was coming in uh with within sa Brook right it's people from across the country uh from various
6:55
backgrounds like the the the the diversity is just phenomenal in the University which just brings a a
7:01
richness in these perspectives right and I really really appreciated that um the number of different perspectives from
7:08
various age groups from different populations uh from all sorts of lived experiences and I knew that there's
7:15
nowhere else I could actually find that that same environment and that's where SA Brook really um like was shining for
7:22
me that is awesome I mean you you I think you expressed a very similar sentiment I was listening to the episode
7:28
on a commu home late last night from uh the university and um it's amazing to me
7:34
how that has held true for you and so many other students frankly I mean I think for so many of us who've been at
7:40
se Brook for a while that is the um the one thing that kind of anchors us to the
7:46
institution is the well the multiple things you identify but those are the things that anchor us it's really quite
7:52
beautiful you mentioned your work in
7:58
yoga and it feels like there's a a missing component here chimi like what how did
8:06
you get into yoga I mean did you just fall into it was there a um a catalyst a
8:12
person in your life was there did you see something happen because this is the reason I bring this up is this is
8:18
Central to a lot of your work that you're doing like with research within the community uh and it's quite
8:23
beautiful work so how did you find yourself going into yoga and I want to come back to the Sab connection here in
8:29
a bit yeah no absolutely I think that's a phenomenal question it's um it's always been just a part of my life from
8:35
when I was a kid so a lot of people in within my community a lot of other Indians that I know or indian-american
8:41
individuals that I know they kind of grew up as yoga being a part of their lives like they parents saying hey do
8:47
this like and it's just really starting off as just a physical practice promoting flexibility um and my parents
8:53
were always uh very very deeply into this world so they took yoga as more of a uh philosophical
9:00
practice and taking all components of yoga outside of just the physical practice but really the different
9:06
streams of yoga the different perspectives that there are within yoga I mean yoga itself is a is a whole school of thought of its own so um
9:13
that's where sort of like with my parents being very very involved in yoga and having me sort of involved in yoga
9:20
from a very young age I just felt that it became it was always a part of my life for as long as I can remember so
9:27
from there around I'd say like my so around the age of 13 was when I got my yoga teacher training
9:33
certification um and then uh I was always practicing it uh you know as a
9:40
kid you end up like you know you you rebel against the things that your parents say or tell you to do but you
9:46
know the value of yoga was just undeniably true right like I can just experience it for myself I can feel that
9:51
for myself and I can't deny that like that I can't deny that I feel great not
9:56
just in the practice of it but when I put myself s in like that yogic mindset and framework of thinking right and it's
10:03
a lot deeper than just the physical practic is it's a way of being and that's really the thing that kind of got
10:09
me realizing the impact of it no matter what changed in throughout the course of my life that was the one thing that was
10:15
always consistent and that something that I could always come back to as a source of comfort a source of strength a
10:21
source of coping if I need it so kind of whatever I need at the time I'm able to
10:27
find within yoga so having that as sort of a constant stream within my life and bringing it to where I'm at today it's
10:34
still I find it still highly relevant and the and what I do on a day-to-day basis in the clinical work that I do as
10:41
well as the professional my the professional work that I do and um I'm not sure if you know but my even my
10:46
Master's thesis was focused within uh primarily within Ashtanga yoga and existential humanistic Psychotherapy so
10:53
um you know that is going to be continuing into my dissertation as well so just always has been a part of the
10:59
fabric of My Life um from a very very young age and that's just continued throughout that's really great I you
11:06
know there's so much um mythology about what yoga is and what it isn't right and
11:13
you you hit on this really important concept I think or notion I guess that
11:20
um it's a way of being can you can you talk a bit more about that I think that ties so much
11:26
into what what we are trying to unpack here especially with the work that you're doing with yoga Bara so I'd love
11:33
to hear more about that most definitely um I think you know there's this common misconception that yoga is the is like
11:41
an activity meant for those that are have high Fitness levels that you know they're supposed to you're supposed to
11:47
be able to bend over backwards and touch your head to the ground so in some way like I'll let you know right now uh Dr
11:53
Long like I can barely touch my toes all right and I've been practicing yoga for most of my life
11:59
so I mean you know there's this this idea that yoga is about flexibility yoga is about um about the physical component
12:07
like a physical practice about putting your body in these crazy shapes you know there's something very simple that I I
12:13
like to mention when it comes to yoga I I always say if you can breathe you can
12:18
practice yoga that it's it's really that simple like uh I was in uh Trinidad and Tobago um on on air on the guardian of
12:26
Trinidad and Tobago and we were uh promoting uh Stop Diabetes movement yoga intervention that we've been doing for
12:32
the last 20 30 years in combination with uh or in in collaboration with uh svasa
12:38
University uh which is uh Premier yoga University in India uh that's been doing
12:43
research in yoga for the last 40 to 50 years now so they've established this very strong protocol and to stop
12:49
diabetes movement and um I was on air uh in in Trinidad and Tobago and just
12:55
providing like I was in a suit and they asked me like the anchors asked me me can you provide 10 minutes of yoga and
13:01
I'm sitting behind like a desk this minute there this high right here um and I'm like how am I supposed to all right
13:06
well that's okay I need to understand what yoga is for myself right like it's not just a matter of a physical practice
13:12
it's not just getting up and doing these crazy movements let me see what I can do sitting right here at this desk wearing
13:18
a suit being miked up for 10 minutes right and all I did was just a few breathing practices just to promote uh
13:25
peace of mind some uh parasympathetic nervous activity so just to get you to calm down feel relaxed feel in touch
13:31
with yourself um and we got a we got a couple several calls after that uh you know High viewership in the in the area
13:39
and uh one person it really stood out to me uh she called and she was in her 70s
13:46
or so and she said um you know I've had diabetes for the last 40 years and this is the first time I've experienced
13:53
relief from my symptoms at all and that's with 10 minutes on air of practice of just just a simple breathing
13:59
practice right and that kind of goes to show right it's it's a lot more than what we think it is or what popular
14:06
media makes it to be and then when I bring it to like way of life or way of being right it's it's really just a it's
14:12
a way of thinking of the world around us it's it's it's understanding certain basic values like contentment like
14:19
finding contentment in anything that we do being mindful in in any practice that
14:25
I'm doing like Dr long I'm talking to you right here like it's important that my mind is here and it's not anywhere
14:31
else right and that's really what yoga is it's when I'm eating my food I'm tasting every every taste of it it's
14:37
it's that embodiment of mindfulness right um and it's it's these kind of values that that really go a long way of
14:44
of having um having contentment having satisfaction seeking not not seeking uh
14:52
material pleasure rather seeking a larger grander contentment and and a way
14:58
of just EX exting within contentment um and and it's really that right it's it's
15:03
really that sort of frame of reference of not being not seeking attachment or avoiding having material attachment and
15:10
all these things are if you look deeper into it are sources of our of our discomfort of our of our disarray of our
15:18
dissatisfaction and when we address that at its root that's really all yoga is so
15:24
building onto that onto the philosophy it is a mind body
15:29
Soul and Spirit connection that's being promoted and not just the body which is often what's perceived in Western
15:35
cultures or within popular media yeah I mean I I think in our in our previous
15:41
conversations I've mentioned to you I I think the biggest turnoff for me when I was when I first moved out you so I'm
15:48
this Midwestern Guy moving out to the West Coast and I was in a I was invited to
15:56
attend a a colleague of mine yoga session it was an iar yoga experience I
16:02
won't spend too much time on this but I I think it it felt all about the
16:08
physical and not that I'm opposed to that but it was almost like folks were
16:14
in competition with one another what I had read about was you know this should be something that is very internally
16:21
focused certainly there's an external again I may be wrong in my representation of this but that emphasis
16:27
on mindfulness about the experience of really being connected all the way through um and it really felt more and
16:35
and I'm sure there's value in this right so I don't want to you I'm sure there are folks who say Hey listen this is
16:40
this brings value to me as an exercise regimen but to me I think part of that
16:46
has been the co-optation of yoga in a you know especially in Western Society is sort of missing the point which is
16:52
what you're driving at it it seems like to me the the full embodiment of the experience of who you are how you show
17:00
up how mindful you are about those experiences I I really appreciate how
17:05
you frame that because I think it's it's important for folks out there to understand that yoga is so much more
17:12
than how it is both practice and represented especially here in the states I mean and that's not to knock
17:18
anyone doing it but take heed of uh soon to be Dr Sour's uh comments so I mean
17:25
that's exactly right Dr Lon like it is and that's that kind of brings me to what yoga bti does right like the the
17:31
purpose of what our institution is and currently organization and uh I can kind
17:36
of speak towards like my goals with my doctorate what I want to do with that organization kind of turning it more into an institution but kind of starting
17:43
as the the the basis of it we're hoping to break those those preconceived ideas
17:48
uh that yoga is an external like it's just for your body it's just to augment
17:55
other practices like it's so you don't pull a muscle when you're exercising or when you're running like you know it's
18:01
it's a lot more than that right and that's the whole like embodiment of our organization is to take this uh these
18:07
ideas that I'm kind of obviously you know very briefly very vaguely discussing with you because we also do
18:13
have those time constraints but um you know looking at that this this this perspective of yoga and really uplifting
18:20
this perspective to make this more of what the generally understood idea of what yoga is to be so I mean if you take
18:28
yoga you can make yoga an adjunct treatment to pretty much anything like you can utilize yoga to treat a variety
18:35
of disorders you can use it to promote positive Health you can use it to promote mental stability and it has so
18:41
many benefits to it and these benefits can only really be brought out when you're looking at it from this
18:47
perspective and you're taking it away from the Western sort of we're just using this as a physical practice
18:52
perspective got it so the purpose of yoga Bari is really to promote that mission and if you look into some of our
18:58
offerings like some of the classes we give the training programs we provide so we provide a yoga teacher training program we provide a diploma and yoga
19:05
Therapy Program as well and what's interesting about those programs and I've spent a decent bit of time studying
19:11
different yoga teacher training programs from various institutions and what's unique about our program is the amount
19:16
of time we spend not practicing something physical I was about to say not practicing yoga but that's not what
19:22
it is it's not practicing something physical in in you know we're spending like 30 to 50% of the time with our uh
19:30
students with our clients with our uh participants just talking like we're
19:35
talking about philosophy we're talking about these principles of yoga that you know people are desperately looking for
19:41
in a world where they're trying to make sense of things they're trying to I mean and this is consist this is always going
19:47
to be the case right there's always going to be um people looking to understand what their purpose is and
19:52
what the meaning of this whole thing is right and like what we do is help provide some of that insight and you
19:58
know it's not like we're giving you an answer this is what the the meaning of the world is but rather this is a path that you can you can look for that
20:04
meaning right you can find that meaning you can make that meaning for yourself you can find that purpose for yourself
20:09
you can understand the world in the ways that you seek to understand it through this pathway and that's really all it is
20:17
so that's what we're hoping to promote within yoga parari and of course you know the outside of the uh the community
20:23
work that we do and all that just the solely the philosophical mission of it are uh the underpinnings of yoga Bari
20:30
really just come down to this which is promoting the the true meaning of what yoga is from its uh from its authentic
20:36
roots from its um prehistoric Roots almost right like it's it's been around for ages so from from those sort of
20:43
perspectives really bringing the authentic uh version of yoga to the people you you brought up something near
20:49
and dear to my heart especially and and and chimi I think one of the exciting pieces around our conversation is
20:57
the many opportunities here especially over the next two years I'm I'm really hoping to call attention to the
21:03
importance around integrative mental health right and and the the facets that go into this and what you're talking
21:09
about really speaks both to my mind and my heart I think around you you
21:15
mentioned that yoga can be a tool to improve mental health you offered up a
21:22
few sort of uh well a few good examples I think kind of in a variety of domains
21:28
can you speak though more about the yoga experience you know the embodiment
21:35
of yoga as a vehicle for mental health um Improvement or enhancement uh a
21:42
little bit more absolutely and I think there's a a couple of ways that that can that can happen right um one is
21:48
definitely just a component of mindfulness right like uh I tell my clients this often um yoga is like you
21:55
know when when I mentioned I recommend that you do yoga right and then they're like but you know I've had I've done
22:00
yoga before as an exercise like you know and I'm like yeah but have you you thought of it as or have you done it to
22:06
exercise your mindfulness like your ability to be aware of yourself to be aware of your thoughts feelings emotions
22:12
to have a sort of monitor of of of where you are and what you're doing and this is valuable for anyone right like always
22:19
being sort of aware of what you're feeling what you're thinking what you're acting like and and having some sort of understanding of that right so that's
22:26
like one component of it just the mind fulness and promoting that mindful awareness of yourself of your
22:31
surroundings of the people around you and being present and that goes along way and just providing a strong
22:39
framework for stability and whether that's cognitive stability whether that's emotional stability you know
22:45
you're when you're able to to understand why you feel how you feel or how you actually do feel when you have that
22:51
control over your mind then and and you're not letting your mind just kind of take you on a spin right like that's
22:58
going to naturally sort of put you in a state where you're in a you you have
23:03
that increased stability that mental stability that you can then build more onto right just if you look at it
23:09
preventatively practicing yoga can just help you maintain that mental stability to allow you to or or give you the
23:16
strength to not actually be pulled away from that now kind of looking at it from a perspective of all right now I'm in
23:23
this state how can I fix this right I'm in a state of some some sort of function
23:28
or dysregulation how can I fix this bring in yoga is both a a a technique
23:33
for calming and relaxation as well as increasing the mindfulness can help as
23:38
bringing forth some of those uh things that are necessary to uh promote uh
23:44
healing psychological healing yes and then we take that that's just the the the physical practice and some of the uh
23:51
some of the breathing practices associated with that then if you take the philosophy right I can connect the
23:57
Phil philosophy to things like existentialism and Logo theapy right like you look at work of Frankle haiger
24:04
um at uh Rogers for that matter right like there are a lot of existential themes that pop up that are relevant
24:13
across the world right like the global population everyone in the world is a human being right we're looking at the
24:20
human population and whether you're here in America you're across the continent in India there's certain existential giv
24:27
that we all experience right so whether that's a western humanistic existential
24:33
approach to addressing these givenin or an Eastern Ashtanga Yoga ad vant
24:38
approach to dealing with these givenin it's the same it's just a different sort of uh a different frame of reference
24:45
that you're looking at it from so you know providing that whole side of that you know I I take some pride in engaging
24:53
in like in using logotherapy and existential uh literature and practices within my within my therapeutic practice
25:01
and I find that bringing a lot of the Eastern philosophy too just helps fill a lot of the gaps in the western side and
25:07
the Western philosophy as well as within what my clients are looking for right A lot of people are just looking for like
25:13
where do I fit in here like what am I looking for here what am I doing here and there are a lot of those answers
25:19
already there within yogic literature and philosophy so that other that's the other side of it so bringing in the
25:25
whole the theoretical backgr of it the philosophical background of it and helping people understand that to help
25:32
them make sense of themselves their purpose their meaning and the world around them I could talk to you all day
25:38
me too Dr long we we're just barely I mean like we're just scratching the surface I know I'm like uh I'm absorbing
25:46
so much real quick um unfortunately we're coming close to the end of our time together but could you offer up is
25:52
there a a would you recommend folks go to yoga barati or to uh do you have a
25:58
book or two that you would recommend folks to pick up about yoga that that kind of expounds on what you're talking
26:04
about I think there are a handful of books uh one is definitely um and this one's maybe a little more heavier on the
26:11
literature but Edwin Bryant's interpretation of panel's yoga sutas which are essentially the basis of
26:17
asanga yoga that's a book that really goes deep into the the philosophical background of asanga yoga uh personally
26:24
uh I mean for therapists I would recommend a book called yoga and Psychotherapy by Swami Rama and Dr
26:30
Ballentine Rudolph Valentine that's a great uh practical guide for therapists to incorporate yoga into
26:36
Psychotherapy um and seeing the sort of uh the parallels between the two paths
26:41
the two modalities of healing as well and then as for you know my own book Dr long I'm working on it so I'll let you
26:47
know when I'm ready and and so that takes me to kind of the final point we only have just a couple minutes so
26:53
you're working on uh you you've made it this far in grab school and for everyone
26:58
out there just so you know when I say that it it really is uh for so many people who are going through grad school
27:04
it can be a very joyful process so um you've you've come this far um and
27:11
you're close to uh really diving into your research on the dissertation tell us just in in a nutshell what is the
27:18
dissertation really homing in on and what do you hope to show uh with the research and that's a great question I I
27:24
would like to so I did my Master's thes is kind of building the foundation a lot of what I just mentioned here which is
27:31
uh demonstrating the parallels between existential literature and the west and in the East right um and showing a sort
27:39
of like a synthesis of the two with a proposed model uh now what I want to do
27:44
is evaluate whether or how yoga specifically how yoga would be perceived
27:50
um as a modality of healing within uh psychother within the framework of psychotherapy so how really the question
27:57
is how can I integrate principles and practices of yoga into Psychotherapy to
28:04
essentially create or synthesize um or formulate a new uh modality of therapy
28:11
that focuses on integrative and holistic healing and that's by through the through the means of yoga and
28:17
Psychotherapy so that's really like in in a very vague nutshell that's kind of
28:22
what it is but you did all right see like I think in fact I think he did very well it's it's sometimes for for
28:30
students who are listening to this it's hard to put everything in a that you're working on that your kind of your life
28:35
work up to the state right like you're really hoping to get that to show and you did a fabulous job I mean that's
28:41
your core message so well done than on the abstract thank you Dr I appreciate
28:46
that and you're living proof that grad school is doable it can be fun it can be
28:52
applicable to the work you're doing out there in the world today so timai it you
28:58
know I know our time is too brief on on something like this but we're excited for our community we're we're bringing
29:05
in chimi and several of his colleagues to speak with our board in a another
29:10
week or so uh you'll hear this way after the fact but I know our trustees are super excited about this um and before
29:18
you go today we have two questions we ask of all of our guests um and it's
29:25
it's really fun um and also really enlightening to hear what individuals
29:30
say about uh each of these two topics so this is quick take so what are the first
29:35
things that come to mind you have to give the star answer right the book textbook answer it's the Chim my suor
29:42
answer so the first one is what does the term humanistic mean to you that which makes us human the uh I think when I
29:50
think of the word humanistic I think of Joy I think of contentment I think of love I think of uh connection I think of
29:58
uh of collectivism I think of multiculturalism I think of diversity
30:04
and I think of the the vastness that is The Human Experience within the global
30:09
population fabulous we'll give you an A+ on that one I wish I could have
30:14
influence on your uh comprehensive exams but you know unfortunately this is what
30:20
we'll see if they'll take the answer offline there so right and then lastly
30:25
um for all of our audience out there uh we found this to be tremendously
30:31
insightful for a lot of folks what are three things an individual a group an organization but really focusing on the
30:38
individual in this case that they can do to help improve or enhance uh their
30:43
mental or emotional well-being from your perspective absolutely that that's a wonderful question um I think one
30:50
definitely right off the bat that comes to my mind is try to find happiness in everything that you do like if you can
30:57
enjoy washing the dishes which I genuinely do I do enjoy washing the dishes you'll never get tired of it
31:03
you'll never get bored of anything you know if you can find the joy find the pleasure find even just some sense of
31:08
satisfaction in everything that you do then you know you're going to love your days um I think the other component is
31:15
you know just having some mindful awareness like I I would recommend mindfulness for everyone you know like and again mindfulness is one of those
31:21
buzzword that I can talk another hour with you about Dr long but um you know just like promoting that awareness of
31:28
what am I thinking what am I doing what am I acting right like what am I feeling just just having that at the top of your
31:34
mind and being reflective about that I think it can go a really long way in just having and maintaining a sense of
31:40
emotional well-being and finally I would probably say just get outside like use
31:46
less technology and take advantage of nature while we have it like I I'm in California right now and in uh Northern
31:52
California there's some fires raging up north and you know the air is getting Smoky and you you know like really like
31:58
get out when you can uh and you know we have we'll have these screens forever so try to get off these screens um get
32:05
outside you are part of a cohort of people I think almost 90% of our guests
32:13
have said to get outside and I think that's it's an important reminder
32:18
because that getting out into the world into nature into the into that which we're a part of and so often we detach
32:26
from that and so I I I want to applaud you and and all of our previous guests for bringing that to the four and listen
32:33
if you're in the audience you've heard it now several times get outside yep yep it helps it helps a lot more than you
32:40
think that's right and maybe do some yoga while you're at it so you know yeah yeah hey get outside and do some yoga
32:46
even better Jimi swport a pleasure to have you here today thank you so so so
32:52
much oh it's it's my pleasure Dr long as usual and I'm looking forward to seeing you again very soon likewise likewise
32:58
thank you chimi I hope you enjoyed chimi as much as I did remember his three major takeaways try to find happiness in
33:06
everything you do I like this example of you know doing the dishes right so um
33:12
you know who likes to do dishes chimi does I actually like doing the dishes I enjoy cleaning um but beyond those
33:19
things right in everything you do there find that little piece of joy that comes
33:25
with it have some mind awareness what am I thinking what am I acting how am I
33:30
acting what am I feeling in this moment and try to get present and lastly and
33:36
and I I really commend chimi and all of our previous guests here this is a common refrain get outside use less
33:43
technology detach a bit from what is anchoring you within your home or within
33:49
your office and get out there uh and it's a good reminder for everam for me
33:55
uh to to really enjoy this planet uh that we call Earth if you want to see
34:00
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34:32
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34:40
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34:47
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34:53
folks thanks so much take care and be well
35:07
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35:15
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