If Jesus Never Called Himself God, How Did He Become One? : NPR
If Jesus Never Called Himself God, How Did He Become One?
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April 7, 20141:42 PM ET
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"If Jesus had not been declared God by his followers, his followers would've remained a sect within Judaism, a small Jewish sect," says historian Bart Ehrman.iStockphoto
When Bart Ehrman was a young Evangelical Christian, he wanted to know how God became a man, but now, as an agnostic and historian of early Christianity, he wants to know how a man became God.
When and why did Jesus' followers start saying "Jesus as God" and what did they mean by that? His new book is called How Jesus Became God: The Exaltation of a Jewish Preacher from Galilee.
"In this book I actually do not take a stand on either the question of whether Jesus was God, or whether he was actually raised from the dead," Ehrman tells Fresh Air's Terry Gross. "I leave open both questions because those are theological questions based on religious beliefs and I'm writing the book as a historian."
Ehrman is the author of several books about early Christianity, including Misquoting Jesus and Jesus Interrupted.
Interview Highlights
On a major difference between the first three gospels — Matthew, Mark and Luke — and the last gospel, John
During his lifetime, Jesus himself didn't call himself God and didn't consider himself God, and ... none of his disciples had any inkling at all that he was God. ...
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During his lifetime, Jesus himself didn't call himself God and didn't consider himself God, and ... none of his disciples had any inkling at all that he was God.
Historian Bart Ehrman
You do find Jesus calling himself God in the Gospel of John, or the last Gospel. Jesus says things like, "Before Abraham was, I am." And, "I and the Father are one," and, "If you've seen me, you've seen the Father." These are all statements you find only in the Gospel of John, and that's striking because we have earlier gospels and we have the writings of Paul, and in none of them is there any indication that Jesus said such things. ...
I think it's completely implausible that Matthew, Mark and Luke would not mention that Jesus called himself God if that's what he was declaring about himself. That would be a rather important point to make. This is not an unusual view amongst scholars; it's simply the view that the Gospel of John is providing a theological understanding of Jesus that is not what was historically accurate.
How Jesus Became God
The Exaltation of a Jewish Preacher from Galilee
by Bart D. Ehrman
Hardcover, 404 pagespurchase
On how Roman emperors were called "God"
Right at the same time that Christians were calling Jesus "God" is exactly when Romans started calling their emperors "God." So these Christians were not doing this in a vacuum; they were actually doing it in a context. I don't think this could be an accident that this is a point at which the emperors are being called "God." So by calling Jesus "God," in fact, it was a competition between your God, the emperor, and our God, Jesus.
When Constantine, the emperor, then converted to Christianity, it changed everything because now rather than the emperor being God, the emperor was the worshipper of the God, Jesus. That was quite a forceful change, and one could argue that it changed the understanding of religion and politics for all time.
On the emergence of the Trinity
Christians had a dilemma as soon as they declared that Christ was God. If Christ is God and God the Father is God, doesn't that make two gods? And when you throw the Holy Spirit into the mix, doesn't that make three gods? So aren't Christians polytheists? Christians wanted to insist, no, they're monotheists. Well, if they're monotheists, how can all three be God?
So there are various ways of trying to explain this, and one of the most popular ways ... was called modalism. It's called modalism because it insisted that God existed in three modes — just as I myself at the same time am a son, and a brother and a father, but there's only one of me — well these theologians said: That's what God is like. He's manifest in three persons, but there's only one of him, so he's at the same time father, son and spirit. So he's in three modes of existence, so there's only one of him.
On the difference between history and the past
What I try to teach my students is that history is not the past. ... There are a lot of things in the past that we cannot show historically. For example ... you simply cannot show what my grandfather ate on March 23, 1956. I mean, he ate something for lunch that day, I'm sure, but there's no way we have access to it. So it's in the past, but it's not part of history. History is what we can show to have happened in the past.
Historians acting as historians — whether they're believers or nonbelievers — acting as historians, they simply cannot say Jesus was probably raised by God from the dead.
Historian Bart Ehrman
One of the things that historians cannot show as having happened in the past is anything that's miraculous. Because to believe that a miracle has happened, to believe that God has done something in our world, requires a person to believe in God. It requires a theological belief, but historians can't require theological beliefs to do their work. ...
[Historians] don't invoke miracle because it's beyond what historians can prove. Miracles may have happened in the past, but they're not part of history. So that applies to the resurrection of Jesus. Historians acting as historians — whether they're believers or nonbelievers — acting as historians, they simply cannot say Jesus was probably raised by God from the dead. But historians can look at other aspects of the resurrection traditions and see whether they bear up, historically.
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Bart Ehrman is also the author of Misquoting Jesus, God's Problem and Jesus, Interrupted. He's a professor of religious studies at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill.Dan Sears/HaperOne
On the empty tomb and the resurrection
Was Jesus put in a tomb and three days later that tomb was found empty? Well, that's a historical question. And to answer it, it doesn't require any set of religious beliefs; you can simply look at the sources and draw some historical conclusions. ...
Before I wrote this book and did the research on it, I was convinced, as many people are, that Jesus was given a decent burial, and on the third day the women went to the tomb, found it empty, and that started the belief in the resurrection.
Apart from the fact that I don't think Jesus was given a decent burial — that he was probably thrown into a common grave of some kind — apart from that, I was struck in doing my research by the fact that the New Testament never indicates that people came to believe in the resurrection because of the empty tomb. This was a striking find because it's just commonly said that that's what led to the resurrection belief.
But if you think about it for a second, it makes sense that the empty tomb wouldn't make anybody believe. If you put somebody in a tomb and three days later you go back and the body's not in the tomb, your first thought isn't, "Oh, he's been exalted to heaven and made the son of God." Your first thought is, "Somebody stole the body." Or, "Somebody moved the body." Or, "Hey, I'm at the wrong tomb." You don't think he's been exalted to heaven. In the New Testament it's striking that in the Gospels the empty tomb leads to confusion but it doesn't lead to belief. What leads to belief is that some of the followers of Jesus have visions of him afterward.
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On why he's interested in studying Jesus' transformation
If Jesus had not been declared God by his followers, his followers would've remained a sect within Judaism — a small Jewish sect, and if that was the case it would not have attracted a large number of gentiles. If they hadn't attracted a large number of gentiles, there wouldn't have been this steady rate of conversion over the first three centuries to Christianity; it would've been a small Jewish sect.
If Christianity had not become a sizable minority in the empire, the Roman emperor Constantine almost certainly would not have converted, but then there wouldn't have been the masses of conversions after Constantine, and Christianity would not have become the state religion of Rome. If that hadn't happened, it would never have become the dominant religious, cultural, political, social, economic force that it became so that we wouldn't have even had the Middle Ages, the Renaissance, the Reformation or modernity as we know it. ... It all hinges on this claim the early Christians had that Jesus was God.
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2021/07/07
24 Video lectures: The Great Courses: How Jesus Became God? – The Muslim Times
24 Video lectures: The Great Courses: How Jesus Became God? – The Muslim Times
BY ZIA H SHAH ON JUNE 8, 2016 • ( 40 COMMENTS )
24 Video lectures: The Great Courses: How Jesus Became God?Holy Trinity, fresco by Luca Rossetti da Orta, 1738–9 (St. Gaudenzio Church at Ivrea). The Muslim Times has the best collection for rational understanding of Christianity
Source: The Teaching Company
24 lectures: Year Released: 2014
The early Christian claim that Jesus of Nazareth was God completely changed the course of Western civilization. In fact, without the Christian declaration of Jesus as God, Western history as we know it would have never happened.
By Dr. Bart D. Ehrman, who is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor at The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. He completed his undergraduate work at Wheaton College and earned his M.Div. and Ph.D. from Princeton Theological Seminary. Professor Ehrman has written or edited 27 books, including four best sellers on The New York Times list: Misquoting Jesus: The Story behind Who Changed the Bible
If Jesus had not been declared God, his followers would have remained a sect within Judaism, and the massive conversion of Gentiles, the Roman adoption of Christianity, and the subsequent unfolding of the Middle Ages, the Renaissance, the Reformation, and modernity would never have taken place. For that reason, the question of how Jesus became God is one of the most significant historical questions of Western civilization.
This world-shaping occurrence, viewed historically, was monumentally unlikely. Within Judaism, there could be no question that Jesus was not the Messiah, who was envisioned as a powerful warrior-king. Jesus’s own followers, in fact, did not conceive of him as divine during his lifetime. His crucifixion, ignominious and degrading, ended his life in a way reserved for the lowliest criminals.
And yet—within a short time after his death, this crucified “enemy of Rome” was named the Son of God and the savior of humanity, and within four centuries he was believed by millions to be coequal and coeternal with God the Father.
How could something this unforeseeable, this improbable, have occurred at all—much less with a momentum that would shape Western history? What exactly happened, such that Jesus came to be considered God?
To ask this question is to delve into a fascinating, multilayered historical puzzle—one that offers a richly illuminating look into the origins of the Western worldview and the theological underpinnings of our civilization. This fundamental historical question and its complex answer speak penetratingly to the spiritual impulses, concerns, and beliefs that have played a seminal role in our world, even as they reveal the foundation of history’s most global religious movement, and fresh insights into the Western world’s single most influential human being.
Tackling all of these matters and more, Great Courses favorite Professor Bart D. Ehrman returns with the unprecedented historical inquiry of How Jesus Became God. In 24 provocative lectures, Professor Ehrman takes you deeply into the process by which the divinity of Jesus was first conceived by his followers, demonstrating how this conception was refined over time to become the core of the Christian theology that has so significantly shaped our civilization.
A distinguished scholar of Christianity and New York Times best-selling author, Professor Ehrman develops the inquiry with meticulous research and in-depth analysis of texts. In these lectures, Ehrman reveals that the theological understanding of Jesus as God came about through a complex series of factors and events, each of which must be understood in order to grasp this most extraordinary and historically pivotal story.
Intersections: The Human and the Divine
In assembling the pieces of the course’s extraordinary narrative, you’ll explore the historical background of ancient understandings of the divine. Here you discover that Jesus’s ascension as an object of faith was fundamentally underlain by ancient beliefs in interpenetration between the human and divine worlds.
You’ll dig deeply into human/divine intersections in Greco-Roman religions, as well as in ancient Judaism, finding that
The ancient world was suffused with accounts of divine mortals—gods who took on human form as well as humans who were exalted to divine status.
Greco-Roman cultures considered certain actual historical persons to have been born of the sexual union of gods and mortals, and earthly pagan rulers were at times worshipped as gods.
In the Hebrew scriptures, God and the Holy Spirit both appear on earth in human form, and the human Enoch, among others, is elevated to become a divine being.
Divinity and the Historical Jesus
As another integral element of the story, you’ll investigate what the historical Jesus said or indicated about himself, digging into these questions:
What were the elements of Jesus’s teaching with regard to his own role in the world?
Did Jesus view himself as divine?
You’ll look into these matters rigorously, reading key passages from the four canonical Gospels to determine whether, historically, Jesus’s public message proclaimed him as divine. You’ll also evaluate whether Jesus’s earthly actions—including accounts of miracles he performed—would have qualified him as divine in the eyes of his contemporaries.
You’ll study the circumstances surrounding Jesus’s death and burial, exploring exactly how early Christians came to believe he was raised from the dead. By examining the “pre-literary” Christian creeds quoted in the New Testament, you’ll uncover the disciples’ original conception that, at his resurrection, Jesus was “made” a divine being by God.
The Son of God Eternal
With the conception of Jesus as divine now established, you’ll enter the minefield of opposing views that developed as early Christians sought to understand how Jesus could be the Son of God. In excerpts from the New Testament Gospels, you’ll identify conflicting notions of when Jesus became the divine Son, following how Christian thinkers began to push this event further and further back into history.
Within the developing faith, you’ll investigate the range of views of Jesus’s divinity that held sway during the 2nd and 3rd centuries. You’ll study the beliefs and implications of radically different schools of thought, such as
the “docetists”, who held that Jesus was fully divine and only seemed human;
the Gnostic view that the divine Christ was a god who temporarily “inhabited” the human Jesus; and
the “modalist” conception that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are three modes of a single being.
The Trinity and the Divine Christ
In the culmination of the course, you’ll trace the development of the Trinity, the theological doctrine at the heart of Christian orthodoxy. Through close reading of biblical texts, you’ll observe how the conception of the Holy Spirit came into being, and you’ll learn how third-century theologians such as Hippolytus and Tertullian arrived at the singular paradox of the Trinity: that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are each individually God—yet there is only one God.
The concluding lectures bring alive the fiercely contested Arian controversy, which pitted the view that Jesus was a subordinate deity created by God the Father against the contention that he was coeternal and fully equal with God. Flowing from this debate, you’ll study the historic events of the famous Council of Nicea, called in 325 CE by the Roman Emperor Constantine to resolve the matter of the divine nature of Christ. You’ll learn how the edicts of the Council formally established the view of Jesus that has defined the Christian faith to the present day.
In the enthralling inquiry of How Jesus Became God, Professor Ehrman lays bare the diverse elements that combined to produce both an astonishing true-life story and one of history’s most significant happenings. Join a renowned biblical scholar in grappling with this pivot point of Western civilization that has indelibly shaped our culture, our thought, and the world we know.
24 lectures: Year Released: 2014
1
Jesus – The Man Who Became God
First, consider the huge historical significance of the Christian belief in Jesus’s divinity, in terms of its effects on Western civilization as well as today’s world. Learn about different scholarly views of the historical Jesus, and trace the remarkable diversity of early Christian thought regarding Christian identity, scripture, and theological understandings of Jesus. x
2
Greco-Roman Gods Who Became Human
In the ancient world, there were many accounts of “divine” mortals. Track this phenomenon in the Greco-Roman polytheistic religions, noting the overlap between the human and divine worlds. Explore three ancient models of divine men, in both mythology and Christian scripture, as gods take on human form and humans enter the heavenly realm. x
3
Humans as Gods in the Greco-Roman World
Delve further into the interface between the human and the divine in pagan cultures. Examine narratives describing people born of the sexual union of gods with mortals, highlighting examples such as Alexander the Great. In the Roman and Egyptian worlds, look at cases of humans who were exalted to the status of gods. x
4
Gods Who Were Human in Ancient Judaism
Here, discover accounts of divine humans and other godlike beings within ancient Judaism. In Genesis and Exodus, explore conceptions of divine beings that appear in human form. In other Jewish texts, study narratives of humans who become angelic beings, as well as stories of the offspring of angels and humans. x
5
Ancient Jews Who Were Gods
In ancient Judaism, beings other than the one true God could be considered to be or even called God. Learn about the divine figure of the Son of Man, and the Jewish conception of a “second God”. Observe how divine attributes of God were personified, and how humans such as the kings of Israel were deified. x
6
The Life and Teachings of Jesus
In approaching the historical Jesus, consider why the New Testament Gospels are the only useful early sources on his life, and study the criteria used by scholars for evaluating the Gospels as history. Then investigate Jesus’s apocalyptic worldview, which envisioned the imminent end of history and a coming kingdom of God. x
7
Did Jesus Think He Was God?
This lecture explores what Jesus said about himself, as well as what he specifically preached. Grasp the nature and purpose of Jesus’s ethical teachings, and his view of himself as a prophet of the coming kingdom. Study the Jewish conception of the Messiah as a warrior-king who would overthrow the enemies of Israel. x
8
The Death of Jesus – Historical Certainties
Regarding Jesus’s final days, review the events that we know about with relative certainty. Learn about his reasons for being in Jerusalem, and the political tensions surrounding the Passover celebration there. Consider what led to his arrest, the nature of the charges against him, and what we can infer about his trial. x
9
Jesus’s Death – What Historians Can’t Know
Look now at events surrounding Jesus’s death that we cannot know about with certainty. Assess the plausibility of the Gospels’ accounts of his arrival in Jerusalem, the date of his crucifixion, and the matter of his burial. Grasp how Christian writers made changes in the accounts of his death to serve theological ends. x
10
The Resurrection – What Historians Can’t Know
Jesus’s resurrection stands as the basis for the entire Christian faith. But what can we know historically about the resurrection? Here, dig deeply into the question of what historians can and cannot demonstrate about the past, and consider aspects of the stories of Jesus’s resurrection that are historically doubtful or unknowable. x
11
What History Reveals about the Resurrection
What was it that caused Jesus’s followers to believe he had been raised from the dead? Investigate the disciples’ visions of Jesus, alive again after his death, as reflected in Paul and the Gospels. Learn also about the tradition of doubt in the resurrection, and the meaning to early Christians of being resurrected. x
12
The Disciples’ Visions of Jesus
In exploring the first claims about Jesus’s resurrection, this lecture discusses the phenomenon of visionary experience as understood by modern researchers. Learn about the variety of religious and bereavement visions people experience, and the ways in which the disciples’ visions and beliefs about Jesus combined to impact their conception of him as divine. x
13
Jesus’s Exaltation – Earliest Christian Views
What did the earliest Christians believe about Jesus’s divinity? Delve into Romans and Acts for what they may tell us about early Christian thought, identifying the “pre-literary” creeds they quote from. Observe how these creeds indicate a view that Jesus was adopted as the Son of God precisely upon his resurrection. x
14
The Backward Movement of Christology
Over time, Christian thought pushed the origin of Jesus’s divinity further and further back in history. Trace this development by looking at views of Jesus in the New Testament Gospels. Focus on the Gospels of Mark, Matthew, and Luke, noting their differing versions of when Jesus became the Son of God. x
15
Paul’s View – Christ’s Elevated Divinity
Paul’s theology represents a transition between early conceptions of Christ as exalted by God upon his death and later views of his innate or eternal divinity. Trace Paul’s seminal role within the early church, and his view of Jesus as a divine being whose actions raised him to a higher level of divinity. x
16
John’s View – The Word Made Human
The Gospel of John differs significantly from the other three canonical Gospels in its conception of Jesus. Investigate John’s contention that Jesus had always been the Son of God and the equal of God the Father. Contemplate John’s identification of Christ as the embodiment of the word of God, or “logos”. x
17
Was Christ Human? The Docetic View
In the second and third centuries, Christian groups followed radically different beliefs and theologies. Learn about the “docetists”, who believed Jesus was not human, but only appeared to be so, highlighting Marcion, a docetist who conceived of two distinct gods—a God of the Jews and a God of Jesus. x
18
The Divided Christ of the Separationists
Among early Christian groups, the Gnostics demonstrate yet another view of the divinity of Jesus. Explore the fundamental tenets of Gnosticism, with its notion of secret knowledge as the source of salvation. Discover the Gnostic “separationist” view of Christ, according to which the divine Christ inhabited, temporarily, the human Jesus. x
19
Christ’s Dual Nature – Proto-Orthodoxy
By the fourth century, the theological understanding known as “orthodoxy” became predominant. Investigate the relationship between orthodoxy and “heresy”, or conflicting conceptions of the faith, and evidence that orthodoxy was not the original form of Christianity. Learn about early “proto-orthodox” writers, and their contention that Jesus was both fully God and fully human. x
20
The Birth of the Trinity
The doctrine of the Trinity asserts that God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit are all individually God. Look into the origins of this mysterious claim, noting that the Trinity appears nowhere in the Bible. Learn about the conception of “modalism”, which proposed that the three are manifestations of one being, and modalism’s opponents. x
21
The Arian Controversy
In the third century, sharp divisions existed between Christians, involving how to explain the relation of God the Father to Christ and the Holy Spirit. Examine the proto-orthodox thought of Novatian, and learn about the “Arian controversy” stemming from the highly divisive view of Christ as a subordinate deity created by God. x
22
The Conversion of Constantine
The Christian conversion of the Roman emperor Constantine was a momentous turning point for the faith. Learn about the relationship of the Roman Empire to early Christianity, and the specific reasons why Christians were persecuted by Rome. Grasp Constantine’s motives for converting to Christianity and for becoming directly involved in theological controversies. x
23
The Council of Nicea
Constantine called the famous Council of Nicea in 325 CE, to resolve the conflicting views of Christ’s divinity. Examine the theological issues at stake, pitting the Christological views of Arius against those of Alexander of Alexandria. Contemplate the political implications of the outcome, and the resulting orthodox creed, establishing Jesus fully as God. x
24
Once Jesus Became God
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40 replies ›
Zia H Shah
June 8, 2016 at 4:59 pm
Wonderful course by Prof. Bart Ehrman to know about Trinity and rest of Christian theology and how and why it differs from Judaism and Islam.
Reply
winstonfrawl
June 8, 2016 at 5:16 pm
@Professor Ehrman:: JC ‘became’ the scriptures (God) because he studied them. There is no God, it is a figment of the jews mentality, picked up in ignorance and passed from parents to children. Read Matthew Ch. 15 second half and see the difference between what is written and what the Christians think. There is no requirement for a God, we are born of ourselves, a product of evolution.
Reply
Zia H Shah
June 8, 2016 at 7:06 pm
Seven Reasons Why European Agnostics and Atheists Should Consider Islam
Reply
Mansoora Saeed
June 9, 2016 at 12:03 am
Islam gives a unifying paradigm and recognizes the spiritual experience of all people over the millennia, whereas, Christianity always demonstrates an obsession with Jesus and in this age of information wants to pull us back two thousand years ago to a society, when heroes were elevated to be gods.
The Holy Quran says, “They are surely disbelievers who say, ‘Allah is the third of three,’ there is no God but the One God. And if they desist not from what they say, a grievous punishment shall surely befall those of them that disbelieve”. (5:74).
Reply
winstonfrawl
June 9, 2016 at 7:27 am
Third of 3-in-1:- Originated in Judaism {1}, picked up (by ear), became christianity (the bible) {2}, picked up by Mohammad through contact with christians, became the Qur’an {3}.
Reply
Zia H Shah
June 9, 2016 at 8:17 am
The Bible, The Quran and Science: Is the Quran copied from the Bible?
Reply
Aihanu
August 30, 2017 at 2:41 pm
most likely; that is why it is clearly stated in the Qur’an that the book of knowledge, the Bible should be consulted when there are questions/ambiquities.
Reply
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Somi Tempo
October 20, 2017 at 11:06 am
Very excellent info. Thank you. We have to read about religion from many view and than decide it witch one is the truth of religion, do not judge others. Let God judge us
I agree??
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Ali Syed
December 3, 2018 at 12:11 pm
God Almighty has enforced his Laws in Nature. Those laws are controlling all the creatures in the universe. God has blessed mankind with extraordinary commonsense and wisdom but millions of people have forfeited their blessed qualities and believe in nonsense, A man born to a woman who needs food, water to quench his thirst, need sleep to rest and in the morning rushes to the bathroom. Could he be a God?? He could be a Godly person but certainly not God.
Reply
Zia H Shah
June 12, 2019 at 9:52 pm
Reply
chapmaned24
July 10, 2019 at 1:42 am
Dr Bart, huh? His education doesn’t impress me. He knows nothing. A waste of tuition dollars.
The only doctors I recognize are the ones with stethoscopes around their necks. Maybe a therapist. No…not the therapist. If you break down that word you have THE RAPIST.
This isn’t rocket science. It’s really easy, if ya just take the time to study ON YOUR OWN.
All ya need is pens, college ruled paper, numerous hi-liters, and a TON of coffee, and many sleepless nights.
But ole Doc Zia is probably way too tired after spending the day in the ER to study. He relies on an IMAM to TELL HIM what to believe.
NO COLLEGE NECESSARY.
No ill will, Zia. Just my natural sarcasm at play here. As they say in the Wizard of Oz (are you allowed to watch that movie?), Pay No Attention to that man behind the curtain!
Ever see the movie, NOT WITHOUT MY DAUGHTER?
Islam is SCARY. I grew up thinking Islam was EXOTIC. Ali Babba laying in a tent, surrounded by beautiful women feeding him grapes, fanning him with huge feathers, and for fun, he flies away on a flying magic carpet. Then I grew up and learned the real Islam. Scared me to death.
Palestinians harassing the Israelis by throwing cocktails that are not drinkable with fire, rocks…and these are children doing that. We played baseball, they participate in violence. Scary.
Iranian doctor marries American woman…true story. He takes her to Iran, forces the Islam way of life on her, HIS FLAVOR, of course, dictates that she can’t come back to America, beats the holy living crap out of her, etc., etc….and all she wants to do is to COME HOME to America. But he won’t let her, and he USES the child against her, abuse after abuse after abuse.
Islam is scary. Then 9/11 happened.
Then Omar gets in OUR congress. HOW? She hates us. You gotta do some serious convincing that your religion is PEACEFUL, cuz I sure don’t see it.
You guys are nice, but of course, your Koran tells you to be, when you are abroad, just like that Iranian Doctor was. But once back home…DEATH TO AMERICA, DEATH TO ISRAEL.
Scary. Free will, huh? Could have fooled me.
Ed Chapman
Reply
Rafiq A. Tschannen
July 10, 2019 at 6:40 am
Ed’ soon I will need to erase your comments. If a husband abuses his wife Islam is not scary, because he goes totally against the teachings of Islam. Therefore Ed, we appreciate your comments about your religion. Let the readers compare. But please stop writing about Islam, about which you have a totally confused idea. If you really would like to know something about Islam keep reading our articles on The Muslim Times and go to http://www.alislam.org
Reply
Zia H Shah
July 10, 2019 at 11:44 am
The comments of Ed Chapman above are very instructive.
It is a compliment in disguise. It is a recognition that he has nothing worth while to say to prove that Jesus is God.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proofs and he has none.
So, his only tactic is evasion and hate mongering and shooting the messenger,
Reply
chapmaned24
July 10, 2019 at 12:09 pm
You are funny, Doc! I provide PLENTY of PROOF and evidence. You provide, what, The Huffington Post, and the like? That’s laughable. Why do you not provide KORAN proof? I just posted a whole bunch of stuff. And you call that hate mongering? It’s in YOUR teachings, not mine.
You people are STRANGE, to say the least. You lie out of your ass, producing garbage, and you want us to take the bait?
Islam, Antifa, I can’t tell the difference. Black masks, and violence. But, we get accused of hate mongering.
You are the ones who posts garbage about Christianity, and you think we should just keep quiet about it?
We have a saying,
PUT UP OR SHUT UP.
Provide your proof when discussing Islam, like we do when we discuss Christianity.
Your Torah is trash.
Ed Chapman
Reply
Zia H Shah
July 10, 2019 at 12:53 pm
I rest my case. Let the readers judge. The 24 lectures by the Teaching company are proof enough. The audio of the book is in the post and Prof. Bart Ehrman’s video above is a slam dunk case. I am just sticking to the topic under discussion here.
Peace and Love for All, Even for the Hate Mongers!
Reply
chapmaned24
July 10, 2019 at 1:08 pm
Negative. Providing proof is based on your own studies, not that of another. If you believe yours is right, provide proof from your own book. That’s what I do. You’ll never find me quoting Dr such and such, or professor whatever. Our evidence is from my book. Yours is from outside sources.
Reply
Zia H Shah
July 10, 2019 at 8:09 pm
This universe speaks of one creator not three. Plain and simple.
According to the Christian dogma, Jesus is perfect man and fully divine. This is an oxymoron. If a man is divine as well, he is not perfect man anymore. He may be some strange hybrid but not a perfect man. QED
Trinity: An apple cannot be a rock and a monkey at the same time …
https://themuslimtimes.info/2014/10/25/an-apple-cannot-be-a-rock-and-a-monkey-at-the-same-time/
Reply
chapmaned24
July 11, 2019 at 12:35 am
It’s not an oxymoron. BODY IS MAN, SPIRIT IS GOD. It’s so simple. Body dies, spirit eternal. LOGOS, not rhema. Before Abraham existed, I exist. If David called him Lord, how is Christ David’s son?
And a whole lot more.
But, when you die, you won’t see Allah, you will see JESUS. And you will bow down to him! Then you will apologize to me!
Ed Chapman
Reply
chapmaned24
July 11, 2019 at 1:36 am
Zia,
Here is your apple, rock, and monkey. The monkey sat on a rock and ate an apple.
HOW IS JESUS THE SON OF DAVID? HOW?
Matthew 1:1 (THE SON OF DAVID)
The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David…
FIRST REFERENCE:
Matthew 22:41-46
41 While the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them,
42 Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The son of David.
43 He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying,
44 The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?
*********45 If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?**********
46 And no man was able to answer him a word, neither durst any man from that day forth ask him any more questions.
——————————————
SECOND REFERENCE:
Mark 12:35-37
35 And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the son of David?
36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The Lord said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
37 David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
——————————————-
THIRD REFERENCE:
Luke 20:41-44
41 And he said unto them, How say they that Christ is David’s son?
42 And David himself saith in the book of Psalms, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
43 Till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
44 David therefore calleth him Lord, how is he then his son?
——————————————-
ROOT AND OFFSPRING OF DAVID
Revelation 22:16
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David,
And that, Zia, is how it’s done. QUOTE IT, LET THE PEOPLE DECIDE. Do not quote the college educated, just scripture. Yours vs. mine. NO COMMENTARIES, cuz I could care less what Doc Bart states. I could care less what Pope whoever states. I could care less what John Calvin states, or Marin Luther. I don’t care. All I want is scripture. Yours vs. mine.
Jesus created David (ROOT), and he is the SON OF DAVID (OFFSPRING).
Ed Chapman
Reply
Rafiq A. Tschannen
July 11, 2019 at 7:21 am
Ed, just give up. Son of David, Son of God, God, Holy Spirit and all that. We Muslims are simple straightforward people. I recall a pamphlet distributed by Christian Missionaries in Ghana. It said: ‘Do not speak of the Trinity, Muslims will not understand it, just speak of Love’. Well, they got that right. We simply cannot follow you.
Zia H Shah
July 11, 2019 at 10:10 am
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BY ZIA H SHAH ON JUNE 8, 2016 • ( 40 COMMENTS )
24 Video lectures: The Great Courses: How Jesus Became God?Holy Trinity, fresco by Luca Rossetti da Orta, 1738–9 (St. Gaudenzio Church at Ivrea). The Muslim Times has the best collection for rational understanding of Christianity
Source: The Teaching Company
24 lectures: Year Released: 2014
The early Christian claim that Jesus of Nazareth was God completely changed the course of Western civilization. In fact, without the Christian declaration of Jesus as God, Western history as we know it would have never happened.
By Dr. Bart D. Ehrman, who is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor at The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. He completed his undergraduate work at Wheaton College and earned his M.Div. and Ph.D. from Princeton Theological Seminary. Professor Ehrman has written or edited 27 books, including four best sellers on The New York Times list: Misquoting Jesus: The Story behind Who Changed the Bible
If Jesus had not been declared God, his followers would have remained a sect within Judaism, and the massive conversion of Gentiles, the Roman adoption of Christianity, and the subsequent unfolding of the Middle Ages, the Renaissance, the Reformation, and modernity would never have taken place. For that reason, the question of how Jesus became God is one of the most significant historical questions of Western civilization.
This world-shaping occurrence, viewed historically, was monumentally unlikely. Within Judaism, there could be no question that Jesus was not the Messiah, who was envisioned as a powerful warrior-king. Jesus’s own followers, in fact, did not conceive of him as divine during his lifetime. His crucifixion, ignominious and degrading, ended his life in a way reserved for the lowliest criminals.
And yet—within a short time after his death, this crucified “enemy of Rome” was named the Son of God and the savior of humanity, and within four centuries he was believed by millions to be coequal and coeternal with God the Father.
How could something this unforeseeable, this improbable, have occurred at all—much less with a momentum that would shape Western history? What exactly happened, such that Jesus came to be considered God?
To ask this question is to delve into a fascinating, multilayered historical puzzle—one that offers a richly illuminating look into the origins of the Western worldview and the theological underpinnings of our civilization. This fundamental historical question and its complex answer speak penetratingly to the spiritual impulses, concerns, and beliefs that have played a seminal role in our world, even as they reveal the foundation of history’s most global religious movement, and fresh insights into the Western world’s single most influential human being.
Tackling all of these matters and more, Great Courses favorite Professor Bart D. Ehrman returns with the unprecedented historical inquiry of How Jesus Became God. In 24 provocative lectures, Professor Ehrman takes you deeply into the process by which the divinity of Jesus was first conceived by his followers, demonstrating how this conception was refined over time to become the core of the Christian theology that has so significantly shaped our civilization.
A distinguished scholar of Christianity and New York Times best-selling author, Professor Ehrman develops the inquiry with meticulous research and in-depth analysis of texts. In these lectures, Ehrman reveals that the theological understanding of Jesus as God came about through a complex series of factors and events, each of which must be understood in order to grasp this most extraordinary and historically pivotal story.
Intersections: The Human and the Divine
In assembling the pieces of the course’s extraordinary narrative, you’ll explore the historical background of ancient understandings of the divine. Here you discover that Jesus’s ascension as an object of faith was fundamentally underlain by ancient beliefs in interpenetration between the human and divine worlds.
You’ll dig deeply into human/divine intersections in Greco-Roman religions, as well as in ancient Judaism, finding that
The ancient world was suffused with accounts of divine mortals—gods who took on human form as well as humans who were exalted to divine status.
Greco-Roman cultures considered certain actual historical persons to have been born of the sexual union of gods and mortals, and earthly pagan rulers were at times worshipped as gods.
In the Hebrew scriptures, God and the Holy Spirit both appear on earth in human form, and the human Enoch, among others, is elevated to become a divine being.
Divinity and the Historical Jesus
As another integral element of the story, you’ll investigate what the historical Jesus said or indicated about himself, digging into these questions:
What were the elements of Jesus’s teaching with regard to his own role in the world?
Did Jesus view himself as divine?
You’ll look into these matters rigorously, reading key passages from the four canonical Gospels to determine whether, historically, Jesus’s public message proclaimed him as divine. You’ll also evaluate whether Jesus’s earthly actions—including accounts of miracles he performed—would have qualified him as divine in the eyes of his contemporaries.
You’ll study the circumstances surrounding Jesus’s death and burial, exploring exactly how early Christians came to believe he was raised from the dead. By examining the “pre-literary” Christian creeds quoted in the New Testament, you’ll uncover the disciples’ original conception that, at his resurrection, Jesus was “made” a divine being by God.
The Son of God Eternal
With the conception of Jesus as divine now established, you’ll enter the minefield of opposing views that developed as early Christians sought to understand how Jesus could be the Son of God. In excerpts from the New Testament Gospels, you’ll identify conflicting notions of when Jesus became the divine Son, following how Christian thinkers began to push this event further and further back into history.
Within the developing faith, you’ll investigate the range of views of Jesus’s divinity that held sway during the 2nd and 3rd centuries. You’ll study the beliefs and implications of radically different schools of thought, such as
the “docetists”, who held that Jesus was fully divine and only seemed human;
the Gnostic view that the divine Christ was a god who temporarily “inhabited” the human Jesus; and
the “modalist” conception that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are three modes of a single being.
The Trinity and the Divine Christ
In the culmination of the course, you’ll trace the development of the Trinity, the theological doctrine at the heart of Christian orthodoxy. Through close reading of biblical texts, you’ll observe how the conception of the Holy Spirit came into being, and you’ll learn how third-century theologians such as Hippolytus and Tertullian arrived at the singular paradox of the Trinity: that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are each individually God—yet there is only one God.
The concluding lectures bring alive the fiercely contested Arian controversy, which pitted the view that Jesus was a subordinate deity created by God the Father against the contention that he was coeternal and fully equal with God. Flowing from this debate, you’ll study the historic events of the famous Council of Nicea, called in 325 CE by the Roman Emperor Constantine to resolve the matter of the divine nature of Christ. You’ll learn how the edicts of the Council formally established the view of Jesus that has defined the Christian faith to the present day.
In the enthralling inquiry of How Jesus Became God, Professor Ehrman lays bare the diverse elements that combined to produce both an astonishing true-life story and one of history’s most significant happenings. Join a renowned biblical scholar in grappling with this pivot point of Western civilization that has indelibly shaped our culture, our thought, and the world we know.
24 lectures: Year Released: 2014
1
Jesus – The Man Who Became God
First, consider the huge historical significance of the Christian belief in Jesus’s divinity, in terms of its effects on Western civilization as well as today’s world. Learn about different scholarly views of the historical Jesus, and trace the remarkable diversity of early Christian thought regarding Christian identity, scripture, and theological understandings of Jesus. x
2
Greco-Roman Gods Who Became Human
In the ancient world, there were many accounts of “divine” mortals. Track this phenomenon in the Greco-Roman polytheistic religions, noting the overlap between the human and divine worlds. Explore three ancient models of divine men, in both mythology and Christian scripture, as gods take on human form and humans enter the heavenly realm. x
3
Humans as Gods in the Greco-Roman World
Delve further into the interface between the human and the divine in pagan cultures. Examine narratives describing people born of the sexual union of gods with mortals, highlighting examples such as Alexander the Great. In the Roman and Egyptian worlds, look at cases of humans who were exalted to the status of gods. x
4
Gods Who Were Human in Ancient Judaism
Here, discover accounts of divine humans and other godlike beings within ancient Judaism. In Genesis and Exodus, explore conceptions of divine beings that appear in human form. In other Jewish texts, study narratives of humans who become angelic beings, as well as stories of the offspring of angels and humans. x
5
Ancient Jews Who Were Gods
In ancient Judaism, beings other than the one true God could be considered to be or even called God. Learn about the divine figure of the Son of Man, and the Jewish conception of a “second God”. Observe how divine attributes of God were personified, and how humans such as the kings of Israel were deified. x
6
The Life and Teachings of Jesus
In approaching the historical Jesus, consider why the New Testament Gospels are the only useful early sources on his life, and study the criteria used by scholars for evaluating the Gospels as history. Then investigate Jesus’s apocalyptic worldview, which envisioned the imminent end of history and a coming kingdom of God. x
7
Did Jesus Think He Was God?
This lecture explores what Jesus said about himself, as well as what he specifically preached. Grasp the nature and purpose of Jesus’s ethical teachings, and his view of himself as a prophet of the coming kingdom. Study the Jewish conception of the Messiah as a warrior-king who would overthrow the enemies of Israel. x
8
The Death of Jesus – Historical Certainties
Regarding Jesus’s final days, review the events that we know about with relative certainty. Learn about his reasons for being in Jerusalem, and the political tensions surrounding the Passover celebration there. Consider what led to his arrest, the nature of the charges against him, and what we can infer about his trial. x
9
Jesus’s Death – What Historians Can’t Know
Look now at events surrounding Jesus’s death that we cannot know about with certainty. Assess the plausibility of the Gospels’ accounts of his arrival in Jerusalem, the date of his crucifixion, and the matter of his burial. Grasp how Christian writers made changes in the accounts of his death to serve theological ends. x
10
The Resurrection – What Historians Can’t Know
Jesus’s resurrection stands as the basis for the entire Christian faith. But what can we know historically about the resurrection? Here, dig deeply into the question of what historians can and cannot demonstrate about the past, and consider aspects of the stories of Jesus’s resurrection that are historically doubtful or unknowable. x
11
What History Reveals about the Resurrection
What was it that caused Jesus’s followers to believe he had been raised from the dead? Investigate the disciples’ visions of Jesus, alive again after his death, as reflected in Paul and the Gospels. Learn also about the tradition of doubt in the resurrection, and the meaning to early Christians of being resurrected. x
12
The Disciples’ Visions of Jesus
In exploring the first claims about Jesus’s resurrection, this lecture discusses the phenomenon of visionary experience as understood by modern researchers. Learn about the variety of religious and bereavement visions people experience, and the ways in which the disciples’ visions and beliefs about Jesus combined to impact their conception of him as divine. x
13
Jesus’s Exaltation – Earliest Christian Views
What did the earliest Christians believe about Jesus’s divinity? Delve into Romans and Acts for what they may tell us about early Christian thought, identifying the “pre-literary” creeds they quote from. Observe how these creeds indicate a view that Jesus was adopted as the Son of God precisely upon his resurrection. x
14
The Backward Movement of Christology
Over time, Christian thought pushed the origin of Jesus’s divinity further and further back in history. Trace this development by looking at views of Jesus in the New Testament Gospels. Focus on the Gospels of Mark, Matthew, and Luke, noting their differing versions of when Jesus became the Son of God. x
15
Paul’s View – Christ’s Elevated Divinity
Paul’s theology represents a transition between early conceptions of Christ as exalted by God upon his death and later views of his innate or eternal divinity. Trace Paul’s seminal role within the early church, and his view of Jesus as a divine being whose actions raised him to a higher level of divinity. x
16
John’s View – The Word Made Human
The Gospel of John differs significantly from the other three canonical Gospels in its conception of Jesus. Investigate John’s contention that Jesus had always been the Son of God and the equal of God the Father. Contemplate John’s identification of Christ as the embodiment of the word of God, or “logos”. x
17
Was Christ Human? The Docetic View
In the second and third centuries, Christian groups followed radically different beliefs and theologies. Learn about the “docetists”, who believed Jesus was not human, but only appeared to be so, highlighting Marcion, a docetist who conceived of two distinct gods—a God of the Jews and a God of Jesus. x
18
The Divided Christ of the Separationists
Among early Christian groups, the Gnostics demonstrate yet another view of the divinity of Jesus. Explore the fundamental tenets of Gnosticism, with its notion of secret knowledge as the source of salvation. Discover the Gnostic “separationist” view of Christ, according to which the divine Christ inhabited, temporarily, the human Jesus. x
19
Christ’s Dual Nature – Proto-Orthodoxy
By the fourth century, the theological understanding known as “orthodoxy” became predominant. Investigate the relationship between orthodoxy and “heresy”, or conflicting conceptions of the faith, and evidence that orthodoxy was not the original form of Christianity. Learn about early “proto-orthodox” writers, and their contention that Jesus was both fully God and fully human. x
20
The Birth of the Trinity
The doctrine of the Trinity asserts that God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit are all individually God. Look into the origins of this mysterious claim, noting that the Trinity appears nowhere in the Bible. Learn about the conception of “modalism”, which proposed that the three are manifestations of one being, and modalism’s opponents. x
21
The Arian Controversy
In the third century, sharp divisions existed between Christians, involving how to explain the relation of God the Father to Christ and the Holy Spirit. Examine the proto-orthodox thought of Novatian, and learn about the “Arian controversy” stemming from the highly divisive view of Christ as a subordinate deity created by God. x
22
The Conversion of Constantine
The Christian conversion of the Roman emperor Constantine was a momentous turning point for the faith. Learn about the relationship of the Roman Empire to early Christianity, and the specific reasons why Christians were persecuted by Rome. Grasp Constantine’s motives for converting to Christianity and for becoming directly involved in theological controversies. x
23
The Council of Nicea
Constantine called the famous Council of Nicea in 325 CE, to resolve the conflicting views of Christ’s divinity. Examine the theological issues at stake, pitting the Christological views of Arius against those of Alexander of Alexandria. Contemplate the political implications of the outcome, and the resulting orthodox creed, establishing Jesus fully as God. x
24
Once Jesus Became God
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40 replies ›
Zia H Shah
June 8, 2016 at 4:59 pm
Wonderful course by Prof. Bart Ehrman to know about Trinity and rest of Christian theology and how and why it differs from Judaism and Islam.
Reply
winstonfrawl
June 8, 2016 at 5:16 pm
@Professor Ehrman:: JC ‘became’ the scriptures (God) because he studied them. There is no God, it is a figment of the jews mentality, picked up in ignorance and passed from parents to children. Read Matthew Ch. 15 second half and see the difference between what is written and what the Christians think. There is no requirement for a God, we are born of ourselves, a product of evolution.
Reply
Zia H Shah
June 8, 2016 at 7:06 pm
Seven Reasons Why European Agnostics and Atheists Should Consider Islam
Reply
Mansoora Saeed
June 9, 2016 at 12:03 am
Islam gives a unifying paradigm and recognizes the spiritual experience of all people over the millennia, whereas, Christianity always demonstrates an obsession with Jesus and in this age of information wants to pull us back two thousand years ago to a society, when heroes were elevated to be gods.
The Holy Quran says, “They are surely disbelievers who say, ‘Allah is the third of three,’ there is no God but the One God. And if they desist not from what they say, a grievous punishment shall surely befall those of them that disbelieve”. (5:74).
Reply
winstonfrawl
June 9, 2016 at 7:27 am
Third of 3-in-1:- Originated in Judaism {1}, picked up (by ear), became christianity (the bible) {2}, picked up by Mohammad through contact with christians, became the Qur’an {3}.
Reply
Zia H Shah
June 9, 2016 at 8:17 am
The Bible, The Quran and Science: Is the Quran copied from the Bible?
Reply
Aihanu
August 30, 2017 at 2:41 pm
most likely; that is why it is clearly stated in the Qur’an that the book of knowledge, the Bible should be consulted when there are questions/ambiquities.
Reply
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Somi Tempo
October 20, 2017 at 11:06 am
Very excellent info. Thank you. We have to read about religion from many view and than decide it witch one is the truth of religion, do not judge others. Let God judge us
I agree??
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Ali Syed
December 3, 2018 at 12:11 pm
God Almighty has enforced his Laws in Nature. Those laws are controlling all the creatures in the universe. God has blessed mankind with extraordinary commonsense and wisdom but millions of people have forfeited their blessed qualities and believe in nonsense, A man born to a woman who needs food, water to quench his thirst, need sleep to rest and in the morning rushes to the bathroom. Could he be a God?? He could be a Godly person but certainly not God.
Reply
Zia H Shah
June 12, 2019 at 9:52 pm
Reply
chapmaned24
July 10, 2019 at 1:42 am
Dr Bart, huh? His education doesn’t impress me. He knows nothing. A waste of tuition dollars.
The only doctors I recognize are the ones with stethoscopes around their necks. Maybe a therapist. No…not the therapist. If you break down that word you have THE RAPIST.
This isn’t rocket science. It’s really easy, if ya just take the time to study ON YOUR OWN.
All ya need is pens, college ruled paper, numerous hi-liters, and a TON of coffee, and many sleepless nights.
But ole Doc Zia is probably way too tired after spending the day in the ER to study. He relies on an IMAM to TELL HIM what to believe.
NO COLLEGE NECESSARY.
No ill will, Zia. Just my natural sarcasm at play here. As they say in the Wizard of Oz (are you allowed to watch that movie?), Pay No Attention to that man behind the curtain!
Ever see the movie, NOT WITHOUT MY DAUGHTER?
Islam is SCARY. I grew up thinking Islam was EXOTIC. Ali Babba laying in a tent, surrounded by beautiful women feeding him grapes, fanning him with huge feathers, and for fun, he flies away on a flying magic carpet. Then I grew up and learned the real Islam. Scared me to death.
Palestinians harassing the Israelis by throwing cocktails that are not drinkable with fire, rocks…and these are children doing that. We played baseball, they participate in violence. Scary.
Iranian doctor marries American woman…true story. He takes her to Iran, forces the Islam way of life on her, HIS FLAVOR, of course, dictates that she can’t come back to America, beats the holy living crap out of her, etc., etc….and all she wants to do is to COME HOME to America. But he won’t let her, and he USES the child against her, abuse after abuse after abuse.
Islam is scary. Then 9/11 happened.
Then Omar gets in OUR congress. HOW? She hates us. You gotta do some serious convincing that your religion is PEACEFUL, cuz I sure don’t see it.
You guys are nice, but of course, your Koran tells you to be, when you are abroad, just like that Iranian Doctor was. But once back home…DEATH TO AMERICA, DEATH TO ISRAEL.
Scary. Free will, huh? Could have fooled me.
Ed Chapman
Reply
Rafiq A. Tschannen
July 10, 2019 at 6:40 am
Ed’ soon I will need to erase your comments. If a husband abuses his wife Islam is not scary, because he goes totally against the teachings of Islam. Therefore Ed, we appreciate your comments about your religion. Let the readers compare. But please stop writing about Islam, about which you have a totally confused idea. If you really would like to know something about Islam keep reading our articles on The Muslim Times and go to http://www.alislam.org
Reply
Zia H Shah
July 10, 2019 at 11:44 am
The comments of Ed Chapman above are very instructive.
It is a compliment in disguise. It is a recognition that he has nothing worth while to say to prove that Jesus is God.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proofs and he has none.
So, his only tactic is evasion and hate mongering and shooting the messenger,
Reply
chapmaned24
July 10, 2019 at 12:09 pm
You are funny, Doc! I provide PLENTY of PROOF and evidence. You provide, what, The Huffington Post, and the like? That’s laughable. Why do you not provide KORAN proof? I just posted a whole bunch of stuff. And you call that hate mongering? It’s in YOUR teachings, not mine.
You people are STRANGE, to say the least. You lie out of your ass, producing garbage, and you want us to take the bait?
Islam, Antifa, I can’t tell the difference. Black masks, and violence. But, we get accused of hate mongering.
You are the ones who posts garbage about Christianity, and you think we should just keep quiet about it?
We have a saying,
PUT UP OR SHUT UP.
Provide your proof when discussing Islam, like we do when we discuss Christianity.
Your Torah is trash.
Ed Chapman
Reply
Zia H Shah
July 10, 2019 at 12:53 pm
I rest my case. Let the readers judge. The 24 lectures by the Teaching company are proof enough. The audio of the book is in the post and Prof. Bart Ehrman’s video above is a slam dunk case. I am just sticking to the topic under discussion here.
Peace and Love for All, Even for the Hate Mongers!
Reply
chapmaned24
July 10, 2019 at 1:08 pm
Negative. Providing proof is based on your own studies, not that of another. If you believe yours is right, provide proof from your own book. That’s what I do. You’ll never find me quoting Dr such and such, or professor whatever. Our evidence is from my book. Yours is from outside sources.
Reply
Zia H Shah
July 10, 2019 at 8:09 pm
This universe speaks of one creator not three. Plain and simple.
According to the Christian dogma, Jesus is perfect man and fully divine. This is an oxymoron. If a man is divine as well, he is not perfect man anymore. He may be some strange hybrid but not a perfect man. QED
Trinity: An apple cannot be a rock and a monkey at the same time …
https://themuslimtimes.info/2014/10/25/an-apple-cannot-be-a-rock-and-a-monkey-at-the-same-time/
Reply
chapmaned24
July 11, 2019 at 12:35 am
It’s not an oxymoron. BODY IS MAN, SPIRIT IS GOD. It’s so simple. Body dies, spirit eternal. LOGOS, not rhema. Before Abraham existed, I exist. If David called him Lord, how is Christ David’s son?
And a whole lot more.
But, when you die, you won’t see Allah, you will see JESUS. And you will bow down to him! Then you will apologize to me!
Ed Chapman
Reply
chapmaned24
July 11, 2019 at 1:36 am
Zia,
Here is your apple, rock, and monkey. The monkey sat on a rock and ate an apple.
HOW IS JESUS THE SON OF DAVID? HOW?
Matthew 1:1 (THE SON OF DAVID)
The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David…
FIRST REFERENCE:
Matthew 22:41-46
41 While the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them,
42 Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The son of David.
43 He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying,
44 The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?
*********45 If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?**********
46 And no man was able to answer him a word, neither durst any man from that day forth ask him any more questions.
——————————————
SECOND REFERENCE:
Mark 12:35-37
35 And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the son of David?
36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The Lord said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
37 David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
——————————————-
THIRD REFERENCE:
Luke 20:41-44
41 And he said unto them, How say they that Christ is David’s son?
42 And David himself saith in the book of Psalms, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
43 Till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
44 David therefore calleth him Lord, how is he then his son?
——————————————-
ROOT AND OFFSPRING OF DAVID
Revelation 22:16
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David,
And that, Zia, is how it’s done. QUOTE IT, LET THE PEOPLE DECIDE. Do not quote the college educated, just scripture. Yours vs. mine. NO COMMENTARIES, cuz I could care less what Doc Bart states. I could care less what Pope whoever states. I could care less what John Calvin states, or Marin Luther. I don’t care. All I want is scripture. Yours vs. mine.
Jesus created David (ROOT), and he is the SON OF DAVID (OFFSPRING).
Ed Chapman
Reply
Rafiq A. Tschannen
July 11, 2019 at 7:21 am
Ed, just give up. Son of David, Son of God, God, Holy Spirit and all that. We Muslims are simple straightforward people. I recall a pamphlet distributed by Christian Missionaries in Ghana. It said: ‘Do not speak of the Trinity, Muslims will not understand it, just speak of Love’. Well, they got that right. We simply cannot follow you.
Zia H Shah
July 11, 2019 at 10:10 am
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[[Life Everlasting: The Animal Way of Death: Heinrich, Bernd Intro+Conclusion
Life Everlasting: The Animal Way of Death: Heinrich, Bernd: 9780547752662: Amazon.com: Books
LIFE EVERLASTING The Animal Way of Death
BERND HEINRICH
2012
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CONTENTS
Introduction ix
I. SMALL TO LARGE
The Ultimate Recycler: Remaking the World 37
--
II. NORTH TO SOUTH
Northern Winter: For the Birds 61
The Vulture Crowd 77
--
Ill. PLANT U ND ERTAKERS
Other Worlds 157
--
V. CHANGES
Metamorphosis into a New Life and Lives 175
Beliefs, Burials, and Life Everlasting 185
--
Acknowledgments 199
Further Reading 201
Index 219
====
INTRODUCTION
If you would know the secret of death you must seek it in the heart of fife.
- Kahlil Gibran, The Prophet
• . . . Earth's the right place for love; I don't know where it's likely to go better. - Robert Frost, "Birches"
Yo, Bernd -
I've been diagnosed with a severe illness and am trying to get my final disposition arranged in case I drop sooner than I hoped. I want a green burial - not any burial at all - because human burial is today an alien approach to death.
Like any good ecologist, I regard death as changing into other kinds of life. Death is, among other things, also a wild celebration of renewal, with our substance hosting the party. In the wild, animals lie where they die, thus placing them into the scavenger loop. The upshot is that the highly concentrated animal nutrients get spread over the land, by the exodus of flies, beetles, etc. Burial, on the other hand, seals you in a hole. To deprive the natural world of human nutrient, given a population of 6.5 billion, is to starve the Earth, which is the consequence of casket burial, an internment. Cremation is not an option, given the buildup of greenhouse gases, and considering the amount of fuel it takes for the three-hour process of burning a body. Anyhow, the upshot is, one of the options is burial on private property. You can probably guess what's coming. . . What are your thoughts on having an old friend as a permanent resident at the camp? I feel great at the moment, never better in my life in fact. But it's always later than you think.
This letter from a friend and colleague compelled me toward a subject I have long found fascinating: the web of life and death and our relationship to it. At the same time, the letter made me think about our human role in the scheme of nature on both the global and the local level. The "camp" referred to is on forest land I own in the mountains of western Maine. My friend had visited me there some years earlier to write an article on my research, which was then mostly with insects, especiallybumblebees but also caterpillars, moths, butterflies, and in the last three decades, ravens. I think it was my studies of ravens, sometimes referred to as the "northern vultures," that may have motivated him to write me. The ravens around my camp scavenged and recycled hundreds of animal carcasses that friends, colleagues, and I provided for them there.
My friend knows we share a vision of our mortal remains continuing "on the wing?' We like to imagine our afterlives riding through the skies on the wings of birds such as ravens and vultures, who are some of the more charismatic of nature's undertakers. The dead animals they disassemble and spread around are then reconstituted into all sorts of other amazing life throughout the ecosystem.
This physical reality of nature is for both of us not only a romantic ideal but also a real link to a place that has personal meaning. Ecologically speaking, this vision also involves plants, which makes our human role in nature global as well.
The science of ecology/biology links us to the web of life. We are a literal part of the creation, not some afterthought - a revelation no less powerful than the Ten Commandments thrust upon Moses. According to strict biblical interpretations, we are "dust [that shall] return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it" (Ecclesiastes 12:7); "thou return unto the ground; for out of it thou wast taken; for dust thou art and unto dust shalt thou return" (Genesis 3:19).
The ancient Hebrews were not ecologists, however. If the famous lines from Genesis and Ecclesiastes had been stated with scientific precision, they would not have been understood for two thousand years; not one reader would have been ready for the concept. "Dust" was a metaphor for matter, earth, or soil. But in our minds the word "dust" suggests mere dirt. We came from and return to just dirt. No wonder early Christians belittled our physical existence and sought separation from it.
But in fact we do not come from dust, nor do we return to dust. We come from life, and we are the conduit into other life. We come from and return to incomparably amazing plants and animals. Even while we are alive, our wastes are recycled directly into beetles, grass, and trees, which are recycled further into bees and butterflies and on to flycatchers, finches, and hawks, and back into grass and on into deer, cows, goats, and us.
I do not claim originality in examining the key role of the specialized undertakers that ease all organisms to their resurrection into others' lives.
I do believe, however, that many readers are willing to examine taboos and to bring this topic into the open as something relevant to our own species.
Our role as hominids evolving from largely herbivorous animals to hunting and scavenging carnivores is especially relevant to this topic; our imprint has changed the world.
The truism that life comes from other life and that individual death is a necessity for continuing life hides or detracts from the ways in which these transformations happen. The devil, as they say, is in the details.
Recycling is perhaps most visible— as well as dramatic and spectacular - in large animals, but far more of it occurs in plants, where the most biomass is concentrated.
- Plants get their nutrients from the soil and the air in the form of chemicals - all bodies are built of carbons linked together, later to be disassembled and released as carbon dioxide -but nevertheless they are still "living off" other life.
- The carbon dioxide that plants take up to build their bodies is made available through the agency of bacteria and fungi and is sucked up massively and imperceptibly from the enormous pool of past and present life.
- The carbon building blocks that make a daisy or a tree come from millions of sources: a decaying elephant in Africa a week ago, an extinct cycad of the Carboniferous age, an Arctic poppy returning to the earth a month ago.
- Even if those molecules were released into the air the previous day, they came from plants and animals that lived millions of years ago.
- All of life is linked through a physical exchange on the cellular level. The net effect of this exchange created the atmosphere as we know it and also affects our climate now.
Carbon dioxide, as well as oxygen, nitrogen, and the other molecular building blocks of life, are exchanged freely from one to all and all to one daily on a global scale, wafted and stirred throughout the atmosphere by the trade winds, by hurricanes and breezes.
Molecules that have long been sequestered in soil may be exchanged within the local community over a long time. Plants are made from building blocks derived from centipedes, gorgeous moths and butterflies, birds and mice, and many other mammals, including humans.
The "ingestion" of carbon by plants is really a kind of microscopic scavenging that happens after intermediaries have disassembled other organisms into their molecular parts.
The process differs in method from that of a raven eating a deer or a salmon, whose meat is then spread through the forest in large and not yet fully disassembled packets of nitrogen, but it does not differ in concept.
DNA, on the other hand, though made mainly of carbon and nitrogen, is precisely organized and passed on directly from one individual plant or animal to the next through a fabulous copying mechanism that has operated since the dawn of life. Organisms inherit specific DNA molecules, which are copied and passed from one individual to another, and so it has continued over billions of years of ever-conservative descent, which has branched through innovation into trees, birds-of-paradise, elephants, mice, and men.
WE THINK OF the animals that do the important work of redistributing the stuff of life as scavengers, and we may admire and appreciate them for providing their necessary "service" as nature's undertakers.
We think of them as life-giving links that keep nature's systems humming along smoothly.
We tend to distinguish scavengers from predators, who provide the same service, but by killing, which we associate with destruction. But as I began to think about nature's undertakers, the distinction between predators and scavengers became blurred and almost arbitrary in my mind.
A "pure" scavenger lives on only dead organisms, and a pure predator on only what it kills. But very few animals are strictly one or the other. Ravens and magpies may be pure scavengers in the winter, but in the fall they are herbivores eating berries, and in the summer they are predators living on insects and mice and anything else they can kill.
Certain specialists, however, some with unique abilities, spend most of their time finding food in one way. Polar bears usually catch seals at their breathing holes in the ice, but on occasion they will find and eat a dead one. A grizzly bear will relish a dead caribou as well as one it has killed, but most of the time it grazes on plants.
A peregrine falcon is a swift flyer that captures flying prey, while a vulture would not as a rule be able to capture an uninjured live bird, so it has to rely on large, already dead prey.
Indeed, vultures, ravens, lions, and almost all of the animals we typically typecast as "predators" just as readily take the ailing and half-dead and the (preferably fresh) dead; they will not enter a fight for life with another animal unless they have to.
Herbivores too take those organisms that are least able to defend themselves. Deer and squirrels, for instance, munch on clover and nuts but will gladly eat any baby birds that they find in a nest. Strictly speaking, herbivores take the most lives; an elephant kills many bushes every day, while a python may ingest but one wart hog a year.
The potential ramifications of recycling are almost as varied as the number of species. I hope to provide a wide view, and I give examples from personal experiences everywhere from my camp in Maine to the African bush.
=====
Ch 1 SMALL-TO LARGE
====
Conclusion
BELIEFS, BURIALS, AND LIFE EVERLASTING (pp185-197)
I have no doubt that in reality the future will be vastly
more surprising than anything I can imagine. Now my
own suspicion is that the universe is not only queerer
than we suppose but queerer than we can suppose.
—J.B.S. Haldane, Possible Worlds
In our family, there was no clear line
between religion and ftyfishing.
- Norman McLean, A River Runs Through It
WE MAY THINK OUR SPECIES GENETICALLY UNIQUE, AND INdeed it is, as every species is. But the mix of our DNAs is really an amalgam of all life's DNA, and in many and varied ways that mix reaches back to a common origin in the dawn of life.
One example of most recent common origin comes from our hunter ancestors, whose skill and knowledge were pivotal, as we've seen, in the recycling of animal carcasses.
Since those carcasses were derived from formidable live animals, which the hunters had to get to know well in order to hunt them effectively, we became empathetic.
We learned that the precious, mysterious gift that we call "life" may disappear suddenly when the animal is punctured with a spear or arrow. In no area did we know less and need to believe more than in that period after death, when a body is little changed and yet suddenly bereft of life.
Where has "it" gone, and where did it come from and why?
We invented stories about human creation to try to make sense of our life and our fate, stories that specified our relationships to each other and to the earth, which then nurtured our morality.
The knowledge to create these stories was short then, but the belief anchoring that knowledge had to belong.
Metaphors helped explain the unknown in terms of the known. For the metaphors to seem true, they had to touch truths of our existence, and if they made us feel good they were more readily accepted.
To the Egyptians, the dung scarab beetle (probably Scarabaeus sacer) represented Khepri, the sacred scarab that rolled Ra, the sun god, up into the sky in the morning.
Ra, believed to be the creator of all life, created himself out of nothing every day and was rolled across the sky, then returned back to nothing in the underworld at night.
Scarab models were made by the millions as amulets and were placed on the heart of a mummified corpse in its preparation to enter the afterlife.
Further instructions for human afterlife appeared in what came to be called the "Books of the Dead" (which the ancient Egyptians called "Books of Coming Forth by Day"), vignettes in hieroglyphics on papyrus scrolls illustrated with pictures of people, animals, demons, and gods.
These papyrus scrolls accompanied the mummified corpse with its scarab beetle on the heart and were intended to instruct the spirit for continuing the earthly pleasures.
The most famous vignette, preserved in exquisite detail, is of a man named Ani, who lived at the time of Rameses II, around 1275 BC.
We see Ani and his wife bowing toward the gods as his heart, the presumed seat of intelligence and the soul, is weighed by the jackal-headed god Anubis. Ani's soul is instructed to speak to his heart.
The feather of truth is a counterweight on the other side of the scale. Toth, the ibis-headed god of wisdom, records the verdict.
Ammit, "the Devourer" (a monstrous chimera that is part croco-dile, lion, and hippopotamus), awaits the outcome of the weigh-ing, which will determine whether Ha, Ani's soul, will continue to experience earthly pleasures during its daily journeys out to Ra, the sun god.
After making his daily rounds, Ha returns to the mummified body at night. If the weighing of Ani's heart tips the verdict to indictment, Ammit will swallow his soul.
The Egyptians believed they could influence the gods, and they had to adhere to rules, practices, and conventions to prepare for their afterlife.
Those beliefs were strong enough to build the pyramids, whose purpose was to facilitate the afterlife of the powerful people who could afford the costs of construction.
But the pyramids were also, as the ancient Greek historian Herodotus notes, emblematic of a time of horror for the masses, who were enslaved to build them to ensure others' afterlives.
We don't believe this story of the afterlife anymore, in part because we understand it to be a toxic one that robs the poor to feed the rich.
We want everyone to have the same chance at life and happiness.
The problem, however, is that with so many religions, by definition every believer of just one is a heretic to many others.
Most religions recognize this serious problem, and the traditional remedy is conversion to the "one" religion, if possible, and imposition of that religion, if not.
For the ancient Egyptians, as for other cultures, ideas about immortality were related to religion. These ideas often included a belief in recycling in the universe as it was configured at the time and that often involved, as is still the case in some areas, large carrion-eating birds.
In the Tsawataineuk tribe in Kingdom Village, British Columbia, a chief's soul returns to the village in the form of a raven. The raven is still a powerful symbol of the afterlife, as the letter from my friend at the beginning of this book attests.
After I received that letter, another friend of mine told me he was trying to figure out how to get eaten by ravens after death: "I'm going to get cremated and have my ashes mixed with hamburger and fed to the birds:'
In ancient Egyptian beliefs, the mother goddess, Mut, was a griffon vulture, the medium to birth into another world. However, the dung-ball-rolling scarab beetle played an even more important role in beliefs about the afterlife.
The dung beetles' life cycle apparently served as nature's verification of the afterlife and provided a model for humans of ways to prepare for it.
As I mentioned, the beetles bury themselves in the earth to rear their offspring. People planting or plowing land may have found their apparently lifeless pupae with the rigid impressions of the legs and other body parts pressed to the sides.
They would have seen no internal organs, only the apparently lifeless body encased in a shell that included food for the animal's future life after metamorphosis. Observers then as now would have seen how one day a live beetle - a shiny new incarnation - emerges from this apparently lifeless pupa, comes up out of the earth, and flies away. They would have noted that this new beetle really "is" identical (in appearance) to the one that burrowed down into the soil a year earlier. The ancient Egyptians thought that this beetle had only one sex, which must have been an offshoot of the belief that a live one was resurrected directly from a dead one.
A civilization that had the means and power to build temples and pyramids, make fine fabrics, and fill libraries, one in which animals were configured as gods and beliefs were powerful enough to induce the building of pyramids to secure the afterlife, would have examined dung beetles and known some of their habits and life histories. They wanted to know about these animals that were relevant to achieving the afterlife.
The ancient Egyptians managed to weave an amazing number
of facts from nature into their creation story, but they had it all wrong: the proverbial devil is in the details. We now possess new knowledge of dung beetles and of much more, and we are writing a new creation story. To achieve the afterlife we no longer need to wrap the human body to make it look like a scarab beetle pupa, nor provide it with food in a dark, concealed chamber with a long tunnel (such as that dug by the scarab beetles) leading in or out so that the eventually resurrected life could fly and frolic.
The ancient Egyptians' beliefs concerning the recycling of human remains to achieve an afterlife are striking, but they are no more imaginative than those of other, earlier people, who were similarly ignorant of what went on beyond the flashy and arresting façade of nature. The first civilization as we know it in terms of cities, monumental structures, and centralized activities arose more than 2,000 years ago in what is now Iran. Before settling in cities, the people in that area were hunters living in villages. They probably worshiped vultures, ravens, eagles, and cranes or at least were impressed by these large birds. Vultures and eagles would have used the animal remains that were regularly available on village refuse heaps. These birds were apparently emblematic; we know their wings were used in ritual dances that might have been celebrations of life and death. Wall decorations at catal Hüyiik, a Neolithic town in Anatolia, from 4,000 to 5,000 years earlier, depict almost life-sized vultures with short necks and neck ruffs (probably cinereous vultures, Aegypius monachus) feeding on headless human bodies. The anthropologist James Mellaart, who excavated the site, considered this depiction "proof of burial:' Another wall decoration shows two griffon vultures (G-ypsfulvus) with human body parts. The dwellings contained human skulls and sometimes jumbles of bones from incomplete skeletons. Did the people have places where bodies were deliberately set out for the vultures? If so, then the birds would have left de-fleshed skulls 189 and some bones, perhaps those interred in the dwellings. Skulls found in Jericho had cowry shells inserted with clay into the eye sockets. Perhaps they were kept as mementos of the departed.
One of the çatal Hüyük murals shows a human swinging something around his head. Mellaart thought that the person was trying to chase the vultures away. However, two vulture experts, Ernst Schüz and Claus König, posit that the person is trying to attract vultures. They base their hypothesis on observed customs in Tibet. One of the first Europeans to enter Tibet, the German explorer Ernst Schafer, reported in 1938 that vultures there had been conditioned to approach when the ragyapas professional body dissectors - swung a sling; the ragyapas would then distribute the body parts for quick removal by the vultures. When the birds had finished feeding, the ragyapas returned to crush the bone remains until almost nothing was left. This sky burial was a convenient, fast, and inexpensive way to dispose of the dead, and ideas of the afterlife could naturally then be incorporated into rituals and religious customs.
Vultures, ravens, and eagles soaring high in the sky would eventually be seen as mere specks, which would then disappear from sight. When these birds descended from the heavens in great spirals, with the wind fluttering through their great pinions, and took the bodies of the departed, it could have seemed logical that they had come from and would return to the home of the spirit world, carrying something vital.
MOST OF US want to remain part of the physical world for as long as we can, and we want another life we can believe in. The strength of our belief in another life depends on what we think we know. Few of us question the nature of the familiar world around us. And yet modern science is revealing our physical world to be more and more incomprehensible and mysterious the more we try to understand it. Most of us are consciously aware of our direct connections to the biological world and how they link us to history and time. Yet as the physicist Stephen W. Hawking explains in A BriefHis-tory of Time, ever since Albert Einstein challenged the notion of absolute time in 1905, we have had only a vague notion of what space is. We don't even really know what time is, yet it affects all of space and hence all matter. From a physicist's perspective, the universe is "curved" and has no beginning and no end. As a result, asking what came before the Big Bang could be meaningless because, as Hawking remarks, "It's like asking what lies north of the North Pole."
The little that we know brings some of our perceived connections to the physical world into the realm of metaphysics, and current science affirms the notion of mysterious connections. A note by Adrian Cho in the May 4, 2011, issue Of Science reports that a $760 million NASA spacecraft mission has confirmed Einstein's theory of general relativity, "which states that gravity arises when mass bends space-time." Get it? I think I do: namely, the universe as we know it is a function of time, but we do not understand time, mass, space, or gravity. But that is what we are made of, what we are a part of.
Nature is indeed incomprehensible at that deep level: there is more in our connections to it than meets the eye - and more than may ever be configured by our brain, even with its hundred billion neurons. I try not to be a sucker to our natural tendency to seek pleasure and satisfaction, which causes us to believe almost anything that makes us feel better and then deem it "right?
But I cannot exclude the possibility that there may be other dimensions to the world aside from the familiar ones and that something lives on beyond my physical self. If so, when I pass on, it will be a celebration for some other beginning and not an end. Even if that is not the case, I have lost nothing and gained much.
Just as space-time connects the cosmos, and the molecules that make up our bodies connect us to past exploding stars, we are connected to the cosmos in the same way we are connected to earth's biosphere and to each other. Physically we are like the spokes of a wheel to a bicycle, or a carburetor to a car.
The metaphor that we are part of the earth ecosystem is not a belief; it is a reality. We are tiny specks in a fabulous system, parts of something grand. We are part of what life has "learned" from its inception on earth and has genetically encoded in DNA that will be passed on until the sun goes out.
Beyond the most obvious physical-biological connections, we are an amalgam of past lives. This is true for all animals, but it seems especially relevant to us because we can in part consciously direct the trajectory of this inheritance. We know from personal experience, as well as from cognitive science, that we are what we experience and remember; we are a symphony of experiences. Almost every significant turn or change of direction in my life had a mentor behind it - someone who cared and to whom I was bonded and who opened my eyes or instilled spirit.
During my first year as a runner, when I was a junior at the Good Will School in Maine, I was mediocre at best. But by my senior year I had made a dramatic turnaround. The first meet that year was against the much larger Waterville team, and this time we faced their varsity, not the JV team we had raced against before. I won the race, and we trounced them. I was also first overall in our second race, against Vinalhaven, and we again trounced the competition. In each of the next seven meets I was the first man in. How was this possible? What had happened in the intervening year? I think I know: I was no longer the former Bernd Heinrich. Even my body was not the same; it now held the life spirit of a man named "Lefty" Gould.
Lefty was the postmaster of the one-room post office in the town of Hinckley. I saw him twice a day when I brought him the school mail in a leather pouch. After he had removed the contents and inserted the incoming mail, I carried the pouch back to school and deposited it at the administration building. To Lefty I was not a bad kid, even though I was a mediocre athlete, had criticized my housemother, splashed red paint on the water tower, earned bad grades, and been booted out once. He was on my side, and he saw that I liked to run, just to be running. He, on the other hand, could barely walk. Whenever I came to the post office, he leaned on the sill of the window through which we exchanged the mail and talked to me as though I was someone who had worth. I think he saw me as an underdog who had gotten a raw deal, as he had, although he would never suggest such a thing.
Lefty told me that he had been on his way to becoming the welterweight boxing champion of the world, and I had no doubt that he was telling me the truth. He told me how many pushups he used to do per minute, how many miles he ran every day. But fate intervened; he fought with the army's Eighty-second Airborne Division in Europe and North Africa and had one leg almost blown off in combat. It was a miracle that enough of it was saved (by a German doctor after he was taken prisoner) that he could, just barely, walk despite all the metal in his body. Sweat would roll off his forehead as he told me of his experiences in the war. I could not believe he was telling it all to me!
I started running harder, faster, longer, even if it hurt, to show Lefty what I could do. He would never know, or even suspect, that part of his spirit would live on beyond his death. But it does. His belief in me and his mentoring are an inheritance from him. Every good race I have run, every running record that I have set, traces back to my last year in high school. Through our bonding, Lefty unknowingly set my wings and pointed me in a direction that led me to college and then to the opening up of the world.
We leave a legacy through our relations with people, mostly our parents and those who become in some way close to us. We are given much but must also receive actively. My father wanted me to carry on his lifelong collection of ichneumon wasps. At the time that seemed like becoming an extension of him, not a real interest in me. Yet much of him is in me. He gave me a masculine, vigorous love of nature, which at this moment is being expressed in my writing this and was a factor in all my previous work. It is the end result of countless excursions into the woods and fields collecting his wasps, listening to his stories, chasing rare birds in far-off, exotic lands, his taking me for a year into the African bush and its jungles. I disappointed him in not becoming an ichneumon wasp taxonomist, but deliberately or not, I took what he did offer.
The more I thought about it, the more I realized the obvious. We are not just the product of our genes. We are also the product of ideas. The shape of my body, the very oxygen-carrying capacity of my mitochondria, the physical circuits in my brain, and the chemicals that move me were in part shaped, if not determined, by others' ideas and thoughts. Ideas have long-lasting effects on us, as surely as, if not more than earthquakes, droughts, rain, sunshine, and other quirks of nature.
In springtime I walk on the snow crust formed at night after the daytime sun has thinned it to a fragile wafer, the ravens fly into the tall pines and build their nests of freshly broken-off poplar twigs and line them with deer fur and lay blue-green eggs After the snow melts away, a not of flowers - purple and white trilliums, sky blue hepaticas, yellow and blue and white violets, and snow white star flowers - bloom suddenly and disappear just as quickly. Meanwhile, ovenbirds call at dawn, the hermit thrush pipes at dusk, then the woodcock sky-dances over the clearing, and the barred owl hoots its maniacal cries from the deep woods Summer brings the tiger swallowtails sailing through the woods and the fuzzy bumblebees to the yellow goldenrod in the fields. Come fall the Red Gods call me to the hunt of the rutting white-tails, and I look forward to the tranquility of drifting snowflakes covering all in white and sealing it in for another year, leaving a palette for the tracks of the tiny shrew and the mighty moose. Tiny kinglets with crimson and bright yellow crowns cavort with nuthatches, and brown creepers and chickadees flit among the red spruces, where they shelter from howling winds in blinding blizzards as the winds whip the trees. It's all in there - the Life - and I experience it and remember it and so become a part of it. You can't argue with nature. It is the primary context for living and for everything alive.
Racing the Clock: Running Across a Lifetime: Heinrich, Bernd: 9780062973276: Amazon.com: Books
Racing the Clock: Running Across a Lifetime: Heinrich, Bernd: 9780062973276: Amazon.com: Books
Part memoir, part scientific investigation, Racing the Clock is the book biologist and natural historian Bernd Heinrich has been waiting his entire life to write. A dedicated and accomplished marathon (and ultra-marathon) runner who won his first marathon at age thirty-nine, Heinrich looks deeply at running, aging, and the body, exploring the unresolved relationship between metabolism, diet, exercise, and age.
Why do some bodies age differently than others? How much control do we have over that process and what effect, if any, does being active have? Bringing to bear research from his entire career and in the spirit of his classic Why We Run, Heinrich probes the questions of how we use energy and continue to adapt to our mutable surroundings and circumstances. Beyond that, he examines how our bodies change while we age but also how we can work with, if not overcome, many of these changes—and what all this tells us about evolution and the mechanisms of life, health, and happiness.
Racing the Clock offers fascinating and surprising conclusions, all while bringing the reader along on Heinrich’s compelling journey to what he says will be his final race—a fifty-kilometer race at age eighty.
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