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Yoga As a Vehicle for Mental Health Care, With Chinmay Surpur
Saybrook University
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10 views Oct 17, 2023 Unbound: Saybrook Insights Podcast
Chinmay Surpur was one of the first guests to appear on “UNBOUND: Saybrook Insights.” Surpur returns to the podcast to catch up with Dr. Long,
- discuss his experience at Saybrook as he enters the final stage of his doctoral program, and
- explain how yoga can support treatment for a variety of physical and mental ailments.
Surpur is a student in Saybrook University’s Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology program. He is also the director of research at Yoga Bharati, a nonprofit organization dedicated to enhancing health, happiness, knowledge, and peace through a holistic approach to yoga.
Visit yogabharati.org to learn more.
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[Music]
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hey everyone Nathan long here president of sa Brook University here in beautiful passadena we're actually in Oldtown
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Pasadena it's so beautiful right now this time of year we're in Fall of 2023
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the leaves are sort of changing color you know it's California you you get sort of the mix and match of that sun's
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out beautiful weather it's that time of year where new students are coming into the university and continuing students
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are coming back um and today's guest is one of our continuing students I can't tell you how excited I am to reconnect
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with him nearly three years ago uh Chim my sorour was one of my first guests on
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this podcast and it was at the peak of the pandemic really and I was inspired at the time by his passion and his Focus
0:56
around yoga uh especially his nonprofit yoga baroi um and we're going to check
1:02
in with him see how things have been going where he's at but also uh dig in a little bit deeper on the yoga side of
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the equation um so that should be fun uh along with being very educational I
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think you'll agree with me on that uh a brief bio in chimi uh chimi suore uh has
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his master's degree and Bs in Neuroscience got his Masters at UC Santa
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Barbara he's also the director of research at yoga barati he's a PhD
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candidate in Clinical Psychology right here at sa Brook University doing fabulous work uh with his colleagues he
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has worked on initiating completing and Publishing research studies at his Alma moer UC see Santa Barbara as well as at
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yoga Bara and now at sa Brook University all right so let's get to it
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with Mr chinmai soror Mr chinmai soror it is a pleasure to have you back here
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on sa Brook insights after several years how are you today I'm doing wonderfully today Dr long and it's a as usual a
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pleasure to talk to you as well likewise it was so good to see you live in person
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a couple weeks ago and uh you you were bright shining excited which was
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fabulous so two reasons for that one you've been in a doctoral program for a few years so you're like still happy
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that's good number two you were like turning me on to all these really cool
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uh things you were doing and a couple you know a new student that you were really impressed by I just really love
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your energy so so good to have you back and see you back well there's a third there's a third you forgot about I I got
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to see you well that Lit me up thank you that I appreciate that very much that's that's
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awesome so um I want to hear about um a few things about what you've been doing
2:54
since then but I think to sort of rewind for our guests you know you were one of our highest downloaded episodes of all
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time for the record really yeah I think people really enjoyed hearing you so maybe for our audience tell us a little
3:08
bit about you before sa Brook so how did you find your way uh through life before
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you came to grad school uh at sa Brook University I think for a long very long
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time I was looking for my place I was always looking for uh since I was a kid
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I mean since I was quite young I remember my mom telling me you seem to never really fit F in with the group
3:30
that you're supposed to fit in with like you know your age group your grade your um your community like the this the
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social group that you're in like why is that right and then we'd kind of like you know talk a lot about that and I was
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always kind of into things like language literature philosophy a lot more at a at a younger age um and as I was getting
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older I mean a big part of my life was service it was uh being a part being a
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part of community and serving community so a lot of that I mean in in my circles in my age group it just wasn't really
4:03
there it wasn't really that present um and I always found myself kind of looking up to older folks uh a lot more
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um and the kind of work that they were doing so uh when I finished my undergraduate education at the
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University of California Santa Barbara um in in biopsychology I think they changed it to Neuroscience now um I
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started to get more into the nonprofit world uh especially within the field of yoga uh which is again another unique
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sort of thing uh to get into professionally primarily into like research uh into public Outreach so I
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was traveling to different countries um and the plan was really to be um
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traveling across the globe uh meeting with various populations various individuals um leaders of various
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communities to sort of uh educate them and engage in a sort of cultural
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exchange about how yoga and uh indigenous forms of healing can be
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beneficial towards uh just maintaining and promoting Health whether that's
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preventative health or uh I mean what what we have a lot of in this country is reactionary Health Care um how it can
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kind of fit in there right um and then as the pandemic sort of started uh it
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just shut down my whole travel thing um and I I was just kind of forced to do a lot of what I was doing remotely and it
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was around the same time that I was coming into you know I always knew I wanted to get into research always knew
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I wanted to do a PhD and always had a sense that it was going to be in within the field of psychology so um just the
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sort of like combination of my public facing sort of work that I was always into um the sense that I had with people
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just communicating with people um you know eliciting change in a positive way
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of course um that that just kind of brought me into looking at a PhD in Clinical Psychology and then
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specifically sa Brook I found the uh the values of sa Brook I mean I'd heard about you guys from a couple of other
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individuals um another faculty I think an adjunct faculty that you guys had a while ago Dr Prasad gipa and he uh
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recommended that uh I should join saber because of the work that I was doing um and I was looking into sa Brook and I
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found just the vision the mission it was just so beautiful and uh very much in alignment with how I was seeing the
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world so um kind of coming into entering the uh the environment the ethos of sa
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Brook I felt very much like I found that community that I was that I was always looking for uh granted you know we are
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all we're we're not in person we're remote um you know we don't get to necessarily see each other as often as
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uh other maybe brick and mortar universities do uh but but I really valued the the the global sort of um
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perspective that was coming in uh with within sa Brook right it's people from across the country uh from various
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backgrounds like the the the the diversity is just phenomenal in the University which just brings a a
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richness in these perspectives right and I really really appreciated that um the number of different perspectives from
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various age groups from different populations uh from all sorts of lived experiences and I knew that there's
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nowhere else I could actually find that that same environment and that's where SA Brook really um like was shining for
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me that is awesome I mean you you I think you expressed a very similar sentiment I was listening to the episode
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on a commu home late last night from uh the university and um it's amazing to me
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how that has held true for you and so many other students frankly I mean I think for so many of us who've been at
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se Brook for a while that is the um the one thing that kind of anchors us to the
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institution is the well the multiple things you identify but those are the things that anchor us it's really quite
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beautiful you mentioned your work in
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yoga and it feels like there's a a missing component here chimi like what how did
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you get into yoga I mean did you just fall into it was there a um a catalyst a
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person in your life was there did you see something happen because this is the reason I bring this up is this is
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Central to a lot of your work that you're doing like with research within the community uh and it's quite
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beautiful work so how did you find yourself going into yoga and I want to come back to the Sab connection here in
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a bit yeah no absolutely I think that's a phenomenal question it's um it's always been just a part of my life from
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when I was a kid so a lot of people in within my community a lot of other Indians that I know or indian-american
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individuals that I know they kind of grew up as yoga being a part of their lives like they parents saying hey do
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this like and it's just really starting off as just a physical practice promoting flexibility um and my parents
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were always uh very very deeply into this world so they took yoga as more of a uh philosophical
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practice and taking all components of yoga outside of just the physical practice but really the different
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streams of yoga the different perspectives that there are within yoga I mean yoga itself is a is a whole school of thought of its own so um
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that's where sort of like with my parents being very very involved in yoga and having me sort of involved in yoga
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from a very young age I just felt that it became it was always a part of my life for as long as I can remember so
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from there around I'd say like my so around the age of 13 was when I got my yoga teacher training
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certification um and then uh I was always practicing it uh you know as a
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kid you end up like you know you you rebel against the things that your parents say or tell you to do but you
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know the value of yoga was just undeniably true right like I can just experience it for myself I can feel that
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for myself and I can't deny that like that I can't deny that I feel great not
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just in the practice of it but when I put myself s in like that yogic mindset and framework of thinking right and it's
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a lot deeper than just the physical practic is it's a way of being and that's really the thing that kind of got
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me realizing the impact of it no matter what changed in throughout the course of my life that was the one thing that was
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always consistent and that something that I could always come back to as a source of comfort a source of strength a
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source of coping if I need it so kind of whatever I need at the time I'm able to
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find within yoga so having that as sort of a constant stream within my life and bringing it to where I'm at today it's
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still I find it still highly relevant and the and what I do on a day-to-day basis in the clinical work that I do as
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well as the professional my the professional work that I do and um I'm not sure if you know but my even my
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Master's thesis was focused within uh primarily within Ashtanga yoga and existential humanistic Psychotherapy so
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um you know that is going to be continuing into my dissertation as well so just always has been a part of the
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fabric of My Life um from a very very young age and that's just continued throughout that's really great I you
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know there's so much um mythology about what yoga is and what it isn't right and
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you you hit on this really important concept I think or notion I guess that
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um it's a way of being can you can you talk a bit more about that I think that ties so much
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into what what we are trying to unpack here especially with the work that you're doing with yoga Bara so I'd love
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to hear more about that most definitely um I think you know there's this common misconception that yoga is the is like
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an activity meant for those that are have high Fitness levels that you know they're supposed to you're supposed to
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be able to bend over backwards and touch your head to the ground so in some way like I'll let you know right now uh Dr
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Long like I can barely touch my toes all right and I've been practicing yoga for most of my life
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so I mean you know there's this this idea that yoga is about flexibility yoga is about um about the physical component
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like a physical practice about putting your body in these crazy shapes you know there's something very simple that I I
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like to mention when it comes to yoga I I always say if you can breathe you can
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practice yoga that it's it's really that simple like uh I was in uh Trinidad and Tobago um on on air on the guardian of
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Trinidad and Tobago and we were uh promoting uh Stop Diabetes movement yoga intervention that we've been doing for
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the last 20 30 years in combination with uh or in in collaboration with uh svasa
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University uh which is uh Premier yoga University in India uh that's been doing
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research in yoga for the last 40 to 50 years now so they've established this very strong protocol and to stop
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diabetes movement and um I was on air uh in in Trinidad and Tobago and just
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providing like I was in a suit and they asked me like the anchors asked me me can you provide 10 minutes of yoga and
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I'm sitting behind like a desk this minute there this high right here um and I'm like how am I supposed to all right
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well that's okay I need to understand what yoga is for myself right like it's not just a matter of a physical practice
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it's not just getting up and doing these crazy movements let me see what I can do sitting right here at this desk wearing
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a suit being miked up for 10 minutes right and all I did was just a few breathing practices just to promote uh
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peace of mind some uh parasympathetic nervous activity so just to get you to calm down feel relaxed feel in touch
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with yourself um and we got a we got a couple several calls after that uh you know High viewership in the in the area
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and uh one person it really stood out to me uh she called and she was in her 70s
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or so and she said um you know I've had diabetes for the last 40 years and this is the first time I've experienced
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relief from my symptoms at all and that's with 10 minutes on air of practice of just just a simple breathing
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practice right and that kind of goes to show right it's it's a lot more than what we think it is or what popular
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media makes it to be and then when I bring it to like way of life or way of being right it's it's really just a it's
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a way of thinking of the world around us it's it's it's understanding certain basic values like contentment like
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finding contentment in anything that we do being mindful in in any practice that
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I'm doing like Dr long I'm talking to you right here like it's important that my mind is here and it's not anywhere
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else right and that's really what yoga is it's when I'm eating my food I'm tasting every every taste of it it's
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it's that embodiment of mindfulness right um and it's it's these kind of values that that really go a long way of
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of having um having contentment having satisfaction seeking not not seeking uh
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material pleasure rather seeking a larger grander contentment and and a way
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of just EX exting within contentment um and and it's really that right it's it's
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really that sort of frame of reference of not being not seeking attachment or avoiding having material attachment and
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all these things are if you look deeper into it are sources of our of our discomfort of our of our disarray of our
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dissatisfaction and when we address that at its root that's really all yoga is so
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building onto that onto the philosophy it is a mind body
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Soul and Spirit connection that's being promoted and not just the body which is often what's perceived in Western
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cultures or within popular media yeah I mean I I think in our in our previous
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conversations I've mentioned to you I I think the biggest turnoff for me when I was when I first moved out you so I'm
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this Midwestern Guy moving out to the West Coast and I was in a I was invited to
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attend a a colleague of mine yoga session it was an iar yoga experience I
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won't spend too much time on this but I I think it it felt all about the
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physical and not that I'm opposed to that but it was almost like folks were
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in competition with one another what I had read about was you know this should be something that is very internally
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focused certainly there's an external again I may be wrong in my representation of this but that emphasis
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on mindfulness about the experience of really being connected all the way through um and it really felt more and
16:35
and I'm sure there's value in this right so I don't want to you I'm sure there are folks who say Hey listen this is
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this brings value to me as an exercise regimen but to me I think part of that
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has been the co-optation of yoga in a you know especially in Western Society is sort of missing the point which is
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what you're driving at it it seems like to me the the full embodiment of the experience of who you are how you show
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up how mindful you are about those experiences I I really appreciate how
17:05
you frame that because I think it's it's important for folks out there to understand that yoga is so much more
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than how it is both practice and represented especially here in the states I mean and that's not to knock
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anyone doing it but take heed of uh soon to be Dr Sour's uh comments so I mean
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that's exactly right Dr Lon like it is and that's that kind of brings me to what yoga bti does right like the the
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purpose of what our institution is and currently organization and uh I can kind
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of speak towards like my goals with my doctorate what I want to do with that organization kind of turning it more into an institution but kind of starting
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as the the the basis of it we're hoping to break those those preconceived ideas
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uh that yoga is an external like it's just for your body it's just to augment
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other practices like it's so you don't pull a muscle when you're exercising or when you're running like you know it's
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it's a lot more than that right and that's the whole like embodiment of our organization is to take this uh these
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ideas that I'm kind of obviously you know very briefly very vaguely discussing with you because we also do
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have those time constraints but um you know looking at that this this this perspective of yoga and really uplifting
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this perspective to make this more of what the generally understood idea of what yoga is to be so I mean if you take
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yoga you can make yoga an adjunct treatment to pretty much anything like you can utilize yoga to treat a variety
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of disorders you can use it to promote positive Health you can use it to promote mental stability and it has so
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many benefits to it and these benefits can only really be brought out when you're looking at it from this
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perspective and you're taking it away from the Western sort of we're just using this as a physical practice
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perspective got it so the purpose of yoga Bari is really to promote that mission and if you look into some of our
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offerings like some of the classes we give the training programs we provide so we provide a yoga teacher training program we provide a diploma and yoga
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Therapy Program as well and what's interesting about those programs and I've spent a decent bit of time studying
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different yoga teacher training programs from various institutions and what's unique about our program is the amount
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of time we spend not practicing something physical I was about to say not practicing yoga but that's not what
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it is it's not practicing something physical in in you know we're spending like 30 to 50% of the time with our uh
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students with our clients with our uh participants just talking like we're
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talking about philosophy we're talking about these principles of yoga that you know people are desperately looking for
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in a world where they're trying to make sense of things they're trying to I mean and this is consist this is always going
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to be the case right there's always going to be um people looking to understand what their purpose is and
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what the meaning of this whole thing is right and like what we do is help provide some of that insight and you
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know it's not like we're giving you an answer this is what the the meaning of the world is but rather this is a path that you can you can look for that
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meaning right you can find that meaning you can make that meaning for yourself you can find that purpose for yourself
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you can understand the world in the ways that you seek to understand it through this pathway and that's really all it is
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so that's what we're hoping to promote within yoga parari and of course you know the outside of the uh the community
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work that we do and all that just the solely the philosophical mission of it are uh the underpinnings of yoga Bari
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really just come down to this which is promoting the the true meaning of what yoga is from its uh from its authentic
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roots from its um prehistoric Roots almost right like it's it's been around for ages so from from those sort of
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perspectives really bringing the authentic uh version of yoga to the people you you brought up something near
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and dear to my heart especially and and and chimi I think one of the exciting pieces around our conversation is
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the many opportunities here especially over the next two years I'm I'm really hoping to call attention to the
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importance around integrative mental health right and and the the facets that go into this and what you're talking
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about really speaks both to my mind and my heart I think around you you
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mentioned that yoga can be a tool to improve mental health you offered up a
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few sort of uh well a few good examples I think kind of in a variety of domains
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can you speak though more about the yoga experience you know the embodiment
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of yoga as a vehicle for mental health um Improvement or enhancement uh a
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little bit more absolutely and I think there's a a couple of ways that that can that can happen right um one is
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definitely just a component of mindfulness right like uh I tell my clients this often um yoga is like you
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know when when I mentioned I recommend that you do yoga right and then they're like but you know I've had I've done
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yoga before as an exercise like you know and I'm like yeah but have you you thought of it as or have you done it to
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exercise your mindfulness like your ability to be aware of yourself to be aware of your thoughts feelings emotions
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to have a sort of monitor of of of where you are and what you're doing and this is valuable for anyone right like always
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being sort of aware of what you're feeling what you're thinking what you're acting like and and having some sort of understanding of that right so that's
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like one component of it just the mind fulness and promoting that mindful awareness of yourself of your
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surroundings of the people around you and being present and that goes along way and just providing a strong
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framework for stability and whether that's cognitive stability whether that's emotional stability you know
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you're when you're able to to understand why you feel how you feel or how you actually do feel when you have that
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control over your mind then and and you're not letting your mind just kind of take you on a spin right like that's
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going to naturally sort of put you in a state where you're in a you you have
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that increased stability that mental stability that you can then build more onto right just if you look at it
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preventatively practicing yoga can just help you maintain that mental stability to allow you to or or give you the
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strength to not actually be pulled away from that now kind of looking at it from a perspective of all right now I'm in
23:23
this state how can I fix this right I'm in a state of some some sort of function
23:28
or dysregulation how can I fix this bring in yoga is both a a a technique
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for calming and relaxation as well as increasing the mindfulness can help as
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bringing forth some of those uh things that are necessary to uh promote uh
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healing psychological healing yes and then we take that that's just the the the physical practice and some of the uh
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some of the breathing practices associated with that then if you take the philosophy right I can connect the
23:57
Phil philosophy to things like existentialism and Logo theapy right like you look at work of Frankle haiger
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um at uh Rogers for that matter right like there are a lot of existential themes that pop up that are relevant
24:13
across the world right like the global population everyone in the world is a human being right we're looking at the
24:20
human population and whether you're here in America you're across the continent in India there's certain existential giv
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that we all experience right so whether that's a western humanistic existential
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approach to addressing these givenin or an Eastern Ashtanga Yoga ad vant
24:38
approach to dealing with these givenin it's the same it's just a different sort of uh a different frame of reference
24:45
that you're looking at it from so you know providing that whole side of that you know I I take some pride in engaging
24:53
in like in using logotherapy and existential uh literature and practices within my within my therapeutic practice
25:01
and I find that bringing a lot of the Eastern philosophy too just helps fill a lot of the gaps in the western side and
25:07
the Western philosophy as well as within what my clients are looking for right A lot of people are just looking for like
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where do I fit in here like what am I looking for here what am I doing here and there are a lot of those answers
25:19
already there within yogic literature and philosophy so that other that's the other side of it so bringing in the
25:25
whole the theoretical backgr of it the philosophical background of it and helping people understand that to help
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them make sense of themselves their purpose their meaning and the world around them I could talk to you all day
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me too Dr long we we're just barely I mean like we're just scratching the surface I know I'm like uh I'm absorbing
25:46
so much real quick um unfortunately we're coming close to the end of our time together but could you offer up is
25:52
there a a would you recommend folks go to yoga barati or to uh do you have a
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book or two that you would recommend folks to pick up about yoga that that kind of expounds on what you're talking
26:04
about I think there are a handful of books uh one is definitely um and this one's maybe a little more heavier on the
26:11
literature but Edwin Bryant's interpretation of panel's yoga sutas which are essentially the basis of
26:17
asanga yoga that's a book that really goes deep into the the philosophical background of asanga yoga uh personally
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uh I mean for therapists I would recommend a book called yoga and Psychotherapy by Swami Rama and Dr
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Ballentine Rudolph Valentine that's a great uh practical guide for therapists to incorporate yoga into
26:36
Psychotherapy um and seeing the sort of uh the parallels between the two paths
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the two modalities of healing as well and then as for you know my own book Dr long I'm working on it so I'll let you
26:47
know when I'm ready and and so that takes me to kind of the final point we only have just a couple minutes so
26:53
you're working on uh you you've made it this far in grab school and for everyone
26:58
out there just so you know when I say that it it really is uh for so many people who are going through grad school
27:04
it can be a very joyful process so um you've you've come this far um and
27:11
you're close to uh really diving into your research on the dissertation tell us just in in a nutshell what is the
27:18
dissertation really homing in on and what do you hope to show uh with the research and that's a great question I I
27:24
would like to so I did my Master's thes is kind of building the foundation a lot of what I just mentioned here which is
27:31
uh demonstrating the parallels between existential literature and the west and in the East right um and showing a sort
27:39
of like a synthesis of the two with a proposed model uh now what I want to do
27:44
is evaluate whether or how yoga specifically how yoga would be perceived
27:50
um as a modality of healing within uh psychother within the framework of psychotherapy so how really the question
27:57
is how can I integrate principles and practices of yoga into Psychotherapy to
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essentially create or synthesize um or formulate a new uh modality of therapy
28:11
that focuses on integrative and holistic healing and that's by through the through the means of yoga and
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Psychotherapy so that's really like in in a very vague nutshell that's kind of
28:22
what it is but you did all right see like I think in fact I think he did very well it's it's sometimes for for
28:30
students who are listening to this it's hard to put everything in a that you're working on that your kind of your life
28:35
work up to the state right like you're really hoping to get that to show and you did a fabulous job I mean that's
28:41
your core message so well done than on the abstract thank you Dr I appreciate
28:46
that and you're living proof that grad school is doable it can be fun it can be
28:52
applicable to the work you're doing out there in the world today so timai it you
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know I know our time is too brief on on something like this but we're excited for our community we're we're bringing
29:05
in chimi and several of his colleagues to speak with our board in a another
29:10
week or so uh you'll hear this way after the fact but I know our trustees are super excited about this um and before
29:18
you go today we have two questions we ask of all of our guests um and it's
29:25
it's really fun um and also really enlightening to hear what individuals
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say about uh each of these two topics so this is quick take so what are the first
29:35
things that come to mind you have to give the star answer right the book textbook answer it's the Chim my suor
29:42
answer so the first one is what does the term humanistic mean to you that which makes us human the uh I think when I
29:50
think of the word humanistic I think of Joy I think of contentment I think of love I think of uh connection I think of
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uh of collectivism I think of multiculturalism I think of diversity
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and I think of the the vastness that is The Human Experience within the global
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population fabulous we'll give you an A+ on that one I wish I could have
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influence on your uh comprehensive exams but you know unfortunately this is what
30:20
we'll see if they'll take the answer offline there so right and then lastly
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um for all of our audience out there uh we found this to be tremendously
30:31
insightful for a lot of folks what are three things an individual a group an organization but really focusing on the
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individual in this case that they can do to help improve or enhance uh their
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mental or emotional well-being from your perspective absolutely that that's a wonderful question um I think one
30:50
definitely right off the bat that comes to my mind is try to find happiness in everything that you do like if you can
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enjoy washing the dishes which I genuinely do I do enjoy washing the dishes you'll never get tired of it
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you'll never get bored of anything you know if you can find the joy find the pleasure find even just some sense of
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satisfaction in everything that you do then you know you're going to love your days um I think the other component is
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you know just having some mindful awareness like I I would recommend mindfulness for everyone you know like and again mindfulness is one of those
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buzzword that I can talk another hour with you about Dr long but um you know just like promoting that awareness of
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what am I thinking what am I doing what am I acting right like what am I feeling just just having that at the top of your
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mind and being reflective about that I think it can go a really long way in just having and maintaining a sense of
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emotional well-being and finally I would probably say just get outside like use
31:46
less technology and take advantage of nature while we have it like I I'm in California right now and in uh Northern
31:52
California there's some fires raging up north and you know the air is getting Smoky and you you know like really like
31:58
get out when you can uh and you know we have we'll have these screens forever so try to get off these screens um get
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outside you are part of a cohort of people I think almost 90% of our guests
32:13
have said to get outside and I think that's it's an important reminder
32:18
because that getting out into the world into nature into the into that which we're a part of and so often we detach
32:26
from that and so I I I want to applaud you and and all of our previous guests for bringing that to the four and listen
32:33
if you're in the audience you've heard it now several times get outside yep yep it helps it helps a lot more than you
32:40
think that's right and maybe do some yoga while you're at it so you know yeah yeah hey get outside and do some yoga
32:46
even better Jimi swport a pleasure to have you here today thank you so so so
32:52
much oh it's it's my pleasure Dr long as usual and I'm looking forward to seeing you again very soon likewise likewise
32:58
thank you chimi I hope you enjoyed chimi as much as I did remember his three major takeaways try to find happiness in
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everything you do I like this example of you know doing the dishes right so um
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you know who likes to do dishes chimi does I actually like doing the dishes I enjoy cleaning um but beyond those
33:19
things right in everything you do there find that little piece of joy that comes
33:25
with it have some mind awareness what am I thinking what am I acting how am I
33:30
acting what am I feeling in this moment and try to get present and lastly and
33:36
and I I really commend chimi and all of our previous guests here this is a common refrain get outside use less
33:43
technology detach a bit from what is anchoring you within your home or within
33:49
your office and get out there uh and it's a good reminder for everam for me
33:55
uh to to really enjoy this planet uh that we call Earth if you want to see
34:00
the YouTube version please visit our sa Brook YouTube page and if you like to support the podcast which I hope you
34:07
will go to Apple iTunes and leave that festar rating and review And subscribe so you can get episodes as they come out
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if you're on Spotify leave that festar rating and make sure to follow us you can of course subscribe to us on most
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many others remember to check our show notes for information on today's guests including links to chimi's website books
34:32
and the like and for more information about our University go to www.ab brook.edu click on areas of study
34:40
at the top of the page and locate the program of your choice to learn more in this case Clinical Psychology and you'll
34:47
find that easily or simply Google sa Brook University that's all for today
34:53
folks thanks so much take care and be well
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on [Music]
35:15
now
▲ 어린아이를 등에 업고 간절히 기도하는 저 어머니의 기도 소리를, 다이아몬드와 루비와 진주로 단장한 십자가의 예수는 들을 수는 있는 것일까. (왼쪽 사진은 70년대 청계천에서 구호 활동을 했던 일본인 목사 노무라 모토유키가 찍어 한국 정부에 기증한 것이고, 오른쪽 사진은 영국 일간지 Telegraph에서 보석으로 장식한 예수상 전시회를 보도하면서 실은 사진이다.)자신을 구원해달라고 애원하는 예수
▲ 영국의 일간지 Telegraph는 작년 9월 영국의 한 예술가가 루비와 진주와 다이아몬드로 장식한 3개의 대형 예수상 전시회 소식을 전했다. 가시관, 손목, 심장, 아랫도리를 가린 천, 발목의 못 등을 장식한 보석 가격은 우리 돈으로 1,500억 원에 달하며, 예수상의 무게는 1톤이나 된다. 보석은 인간의 물질적인 욕망, 예수의 순수한 희생 등을 의미한다고 했다.십자가 군병들아, 예수 위해 일어나라!
▲ 1970년대 금관을 쓰고 박제가 된 예수는 40년이 지난 지금 시멘트 쪼가리 하나 벗겨지지 않은 채 <예수 없는 예수 교회> 안에 그대로 굳어 있다. 저자 한완상 선생은 예수에게 덧씌운 껍데기를 벗기고 나사렛 예수, 갈릴리의 예수를 온전히 만나야 한다고 호소한다.