2023/04/17

Lou Andreas-Salomé - Wikipedia

Lou Andreas-Salomé - Wikipedia

Lou Andreas-Salomé

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Lou Andreas-Salomé
Lou Andreas-Salomé - Foto Atelier Elvira.jpg
Lou Andreas-Salomé in 1897
Born12 February 1861
Died5 February 1937 (aged 75)
Göttingen, Germany
NationalityGerman

Lou Andreas-Salomé (born either Louise von Salomé or Luíza Gustavovna Salomé or Lioulia von Salomé, Russian: Луиза Густавовна Саломе; 12 February 1861 – 5 February 1937) was a Russian-born psychoanalyst and a well-traveled author, narrator, and essayist from a French Huguenot-German family.[1] Her diverse intellectual interests led to friendships with a broad array of distinguished thinkers, including Friedrich NietzscheSigmund FreudPaul Rée, and Rainer Maria Rilke.[2]

Life[edit]

Early years[edit]

Lou Salomé was born in St. Petersburg to Gustav Ludwig von Salomé (1807–1878), and Louise von Salomé (née Wilm) (1823–1913). Lou was their only daughter; they had five sons. Although she would later be attacked by the Nazis as a "Finnish Jew",[3] her parents were actually of French Huguenot and Northern German descent.[4] The youngest of six children, she grew up in a wealthy and well-cultured household, with all children learning Russian, German, and French; Salomé was allowed to attend her brothers' classes.

Born into a strictly Protestant family, Salomé grew to resent the Reformed church and Hermann Dalton, the Orthodox Protestant pastor. She refused to be confirmed by Dalton, officially left the church at age 16, but remained interested in intellectual pursuits in the areas of philosophy, literature and religion.

In fact, she was fascinated by the sermons of the Dutch pastor Hendrik Gillot, known in St. Petersburg as an opponent of Dalton's. Gillot, 25 years her senior, took her on as a student, engaging with her in the fields of theology, philosophy, world religions, and French and German literature. Together they studied innumerable authors, philosophers, theological and religious subjects, and all of this wide-ranging study laid the groundwork for her intellectual encounters with very well-known thinkers of her time. Gillot became so smitten with Salomé that he wanted to divorce his wife and marry his young student. Salomé refused, for she was not interested in marriage and sexual relations. Though disappointed and shocked by this development, she remained friends with Gillot.

Following her father's death in 1879, Salomé and her mother went to Zürich so Salomé could acquire a university education as a "guest student." In her one year at the University of Zurich—one of the few schools that accepted female students—Salomé attended lectures in philosophy (logic, history of philosophy, ancient philosophy, and psychology) and theology (dogmatics). During this time, Salomé's physical health was failing due to lung disease, causing her to cough up blood. Due to this, she was instructed to heal in warmer climates, so in February 1882, Salomé and her mother went to Rome.

Left to right, Andreas-Salomé, Rée and Nietzsche (1882)

Rée and Nietzsche, and later life[edit]

Salomé's mother took her to Rome when Salomé was 21. At a literary salon in the city, Salomé became acquainted with the author Paul Rée. Rée proposed to her, but she instead suggested that they live and study together as 'brother and sister' along with another man for company, and thereby establish an academic commune.[5] Rée accepted the idea, and suggested that they be joined by his friend Friedrich Nietzsche. The two met Nietzsche in Rome in April 1882, and Nietzsche is believed to have instantly fallen in love with Salomé, as Rée had earlier done. Nietzsche asked Rée to propose marriage to Salomé on his behalf, which she rejected. She had been interested in Nietzsche as a friend, but not as a husband.[5] Nietzsche nonetheless was content to join Rée and Salomé touring through Switzerland and Italy together, planning their commune. On 13 May, in Lucerne, when Nietzsche was alone with Salomé, he earnestly proposed marriage to her again, and she again rejected him. He was happy to continue with the plans for an academic commune.[5] After discovering the situation, Nietzsche's sister Elisabeth became determined to get Nietzsche away from what she described as the "immoral woman".[6] The three travelled with Salomé's mother through Italy and considered where they would set up their "Winterplan" commune. This commune was intended to be set up in an abandoned monastery, but as no suitable location was found, the plan was abandoned.

After arriving in Leipzig in October 1882, the three spent a number of weeks together. However, the following month Rée and Salomé parted company with Nietzsche, leaving for Stibbe without any plans to meet again. Nietzsche soon fell into a period of mental anguish, although he continued to write to Rée, asking him, "We shall see one another from time to time, won't we?"[7] In later recriminations, Nietzsche would blame the failure in his attempts to woo Salomé both on Salomé, Rée, and on the intrigues of his sister (who had written letters to the families of Salomé and Rée to disrupt their plans for the commune). Nietzsche wrote of the affair in 1883 that he felt "genuine hatred for [his] sister".[7]

Salomé would later (1894) write a study, Friedrich Nietzsche in seinen Werken (Friedrich Nietzsche in his Works), of Nietzsche's personality and philosophy.[8]

In 1884 Salomé became acquainted with Helene von Druskowitz, the second woman to receive a philosophy doctorate in Zurich.[citation needed] It was also rumoured that Salomé later had a romantic relationship with Sigmund Freud.[9]

Marriage and relationships[edit]

Salomé and Rée moved to Berlin and lived together until a few years before her celibate marriage[10] to linguistics scholar Friedrich Carl Andreas. Despite her opposition to marriage and her open relationships with other men, Salomé and Andreas remained married from 1887 until his death in 1930.

Salomé's co-habitation with Andreas caused the despairing Rée to fade from Salomé's life despite her assurances. Throughout her married life, she engaged in affairs and/or correspondence with the German journalist and politician Georg Ledebour, the Austrian poet Rainer Maria Rilke, about whom she wrote an analytical memoir,[11] and the psychoanalysts Sigmund Freud and Victor Tausk, among others. Accounts of many of these are given in her volume Lebensrückblick. Her relationship with Freud was still quite intellectual despite gossip about their romantic involvement. In one letter Freud commends Salomé's deep understanding of people so much that he believed she understood people better than they understood themselves. The two often exchanged letters.[12]

Meeting Rilke[edit]

In May 1897, in Munich, she met Rilke, who had been introduced to her by Jacob Wassermann.[13] She was 37 while Rilke was only 21. She had already published with some success Im Kampf um Gott "where she exposed the problem of loss of faith (which had been her own for a long time)", several articles, and the study Jesus der Jude that Rilke had read.[13]

As Philippe Jaccottet reports, Salomé wrote in Lebensrückblick: "I was your wife for years because you were the first reality, where man and body are indistinguishable from each other, an indisputable fact of life itself. I could have said literally what you told me when you confessed your love to me: Only you are real. That is how we became husband and wife even before we became friends, not by choice, but by this unfathomable marriage [...] We were brother and sister, but as in a distant past, before the marriage between brother and sister became sacrilegious".[14]

In 1899 with her husband Friedrich-Carl, then again in 1900, Lou travelled to Russia, the second time with Rilke, whose first name she changed from René to Rainer.[15] She taught him Russian, to read Tolstoy (whom he would later meet) and Pushkin. She introduced him to patrons and other people in the arts, remaining Rilke's advisor, confidante, and muse throughout his adult life.[10] The romance between the poet and Lou lasted three years, then turned into a friendship, which would continue until Rilke's death, as evidenced by their correspondence. In 1937, Freud said of Salomé's relationship with Rilke: "she was both the muse and the attentive mother of the great poet".[16]

Death[edit]

Lou Andreas-Salomé's grave in Göttingen

By 1930, Salomé was increasingly weak, suffered from a heart condition and diabetes, and had to be treated several times in the hospital. Her husband visited her daily during a six-week stay after a foot operation, which was arduous for the old, rather ill man, and this made them grow very close after a forty-year marriage marked by hurtful behaviour on both sides and long periods of non-communication.[17] Freud appreciated this from afar, writing: "only what is true proves itself so long-lasting" ("So dauerhaft beweist sich doch nur das Echte."). Friedrich Carl Andreas died of cancer in 1930, and Salomé herself underwent a difficult cancer operation in 1935. At the age of 74, she ceased to work as a psychoanalyst.

On the evening of 5 February 1937, Salomé died in her sleep due to uremia in Göttingen. Her urn was laid to rest in her husband's grave in the cemetery on the Groner Landstraße in Göttingen. She is commemorated in the city by a memorial plaque outside the property where her house stood, a street named after her (Lou-Andreas-Salomé-Weg), and the name of the Lou Andreas-Salomé Institut für Psychoanalyse und Psychotherapie. A few days before her death, the Gestapo confiscated her library (according to other sources it was an SA group who destroyed the library shortly after her death). The reasons given for this confiscation were that she had been a colleague of Sigmund Freud's, had practised "a Jewish science", and owned many books by Jewish authors.[18]

Work[edit]

Salomé was a prolific writer who wrote fiction, criticism and essays on religion, philosophy, sexuality and psychology.[19] A uniform edition of her works is being published in Germany by MedienEdition Welsch.[20] She authored a "Hymn to Life" that so deeply impressed Nietzsche that he was moved to set it to music. Salomé's literary and analytical studies became such a vogue in Göttingen, where she lived late in her life, that the Gestapo waited until shortly after her death to "clean" her library of works by Jews.

She was one of the first female psychoanalysts and one of the first women to write psychoanalytically on female sexuality,[21] before Helene Deutsch, for instance in her essay on the anal-erotic (1916),[22] an essay admired by Freud.[23] However, she had written about the psychology of female sexuality before she ever met Freud, in her book Die Erotik (1911).

She wrote more than a dozen novels and novellas, including Im Kampf um GottRuthRodinkaMaFenitschka – eine Ausschweifung, as well as non-fiction studies such as Henrik Ibsens Frauengestalten (1892), a study of Ibsen's female characters, and a book on Nietzsche, Friedrich Nietzsche in seinen Werken (1894). The first English translation of her novel Das Haus (1921) appeared in 2021 under the title Anneliese's House, in an annotated edition by Frank Beck and Raleigh Whitinger.[24]

Salomé edited a memoir about Rilke after his death in 1926. Among her works is also her Lebensrückblick, which she wrote during her last years based on memories of her life as a free woman. In her memoirs, first published in their original German in 1951, she goes into depth about her faith and her relationships.

Whoever reaches into a rosebush may seize a handful of flowers; but no matter how many one holds, it's only a small portion of the whole. Nevertheless, a handful is enough to experience the nature of the flowers. Only if we refuse to reach into the bush, because we can't possibly seize all the flowers at once, or if we spread out our handful of roses as if it were the whole of the bush itself – only then does it bloom apart from us, unknown to us, and we are left alone.[25]

Salomé is said to have remarked in her last days, "I have really done nothing but work all my life, work ... why?" And in her last hours, as if talking to herself, she is reported to have said, "If I let my thoughts roam I find no one. The best, after all, is death."[26]

Published works[edit]

Lou Andreas-Salomé's published works as cited by An Encyclopedia of Continental Women Writers.[27]: 36–38 

  • Im Kampf um Gott, 1885.
  • Henrik Ibsens Frau-Gestalten, 1892.
  • Friedrich Nietzsche in seinen Werken, 1894.
  • Ruth, 1895, 1897.
  • Fenitshcka. Eine Ausschweifung, 1898,1983.
  • Menschenkinder, 1899.
  • Aus fremder Seele, 1901.
  • Ma, 1901.
  • Im Zwischenland, 1902.
  • Die Erotik, 1910.
  • Drei Briefe an einen Knaben, 1917.
  • Das Haus, 1919,1927.
  • Die Stunde ohne Gott und andere Kindergeschichten, 1921.
  • Der Teufel und seine Grossmutter, 1922.
  • Rodinka, 1923.
  • Rainer Maria Rilke, 1928.
  • Mein Dank an Freud: Offener Brief an Professor Freud zu seinem 75 Geburtstag, 1931.
  • Lebensrückblick. Grundriss einiger Lebenserinnerungen, ed. E. Pfeiffer, 1951, 1968.
  • Rainer Maria Rilke – Lou Andreas-Salomé. Briefwechsel, ed. E. Pfeiffer, 1952.
  • In der Schule bei Freud, ed. E. Pfeiffer, 1958.
  • Sigmund Freud – Lou Andreas-Salomé. Briefwechsel, ed. E. Pfeiffer, 1966.
  • Friedrich Nietzsche, Paul Rée, Lou von Salomé: Die Dokumente ihrer Begegnung, ed. E. Pfeiffer, 1970.

Translations:

  • The Freud Journal of Lou Andreas-Salomé, tr. Stanley Leavy, 1964.
  • Sigmund Freud and Lou Andreas-Salomé, Letters, tr. byu W. and E. Robson Scott, 1972.
  • Ibsen's Heroines, ed., tr., and introd. by Siegfried Mandel, 1985.
  • Anneliese's House, edited and translated by Frank Beck and Raleigh Whitinger. Boydell and Brewer, 2021.

In fiction and film[edit]

Fictional accounts of Salomé's relationship with Nietzsche occur in four novels: Irvin Yalom's When Nietzsche Wept,[28] Lance Olsen's Nietzsche's Kisses, Beatriz Rivas', La hora sin diosas (The time without goddesses).[29] and William Bayer's The Luzern Photograph, in which two reenactments of the famous image of her with Nietzsche and Rée impact a murder in contemporary Oakland, California.[30]

Mexican playwright Sabina Berman includes Lou Andreas-Salomé as a character in her 2000 play Feliz nuevo siglo, Doktor Freud (Freud Skating).[31]

Salomé is also fictionalized in Angela von der Lippe's The Truth about Lou,[32] in Brenda Webster's Vienna Triangle,[33] in Clare Morgan's A Book for All and None,[34] in Robert Langs' two-act play Freud's Bird of Prey,[35] and in Araceli Bruch's five-act play Re-Call (written in Catalan).[36]

In Liliana Cavani's movie Al di la' del bene e del male (Beyond Good and Evil) Salome is played by Dominique Sanda. In Pinchas Perry's film version of When Nietzsche Wept, Salome is played by Katheryn Winnick.

Lou Salome, an opera in two acts by Giuseppe Sinopoli with libretto from Karl Dietrich Gräwe, premiered 1981 at the Bavarian State Opera, with August Everding as General Director, staging by Götz Friedrich and set design by Andreas Reinhardt.[37]

Lou Andreas-Salomé, The Audacity to be Free [de], a German-language movie directed by Cordula Kablitz-Post [de], released in German cinemas on 30 June 2016.[38] Andreas-Salome is portrayed onscreen by Katharina Lorenz [de] and as a young woman by Liv Lisa Fries. The film was released in New York City and Los Angeles in April 2018, with a wider release to follow.

Notes[edit]

  1. ^ "Lou Andreas-Salome biography"Encyclopædia Britannica.
  2. ^ "Lou Andreas-Salome | German writer"Encyclopædia Britannica. Retrieved 17 July 2017.
  3. ^ Young, Julian. Friedrich Nietzsche: A Philosophical Biography. Cambridge University Press (2010) p. 553. ISBN 9780521871174
  4. ^ Powell, Anthony (1994). Under Review: Further Writings on Writers, 1946–1990University of Chicago Press. p. 440. ISBN 0-226-67712-5.
  5. Jump up to:a b c Nietzsche: The Man and his Philosophy, by R.J. Hollingdale (Cambridge University Press 1999), page 149
  6. ^ Nietzsche: The Man and his Philosophy, by R.J. Hollingdale (Cambridge University Press 1999), page 151
  7. Jump up to:a b Nietzsche: The Man and his Philosophy, by R.J. Hollingdale (Cambridge University Press 1999), page 152
  8. ^ Salomé, 2001
  9. ^ Borossa, Julia; Rooney, Caroline. "Suffering, Transience and Immortal Longings Salomé Between Neitzsche and Freud"The Gale Group. Sage Publications. Retrieved 1 December 2016.
  10. Jump up to:a b Mark M. Anderson, "The Poet and the Muse", The Nation, 3 July 2006, pp. 40–41.
  11. ^ Andreas-Salomé, 2003
  12. ^ Borossa, Julia; Rooney, Caroline. "Suffering, Transience and Immortal Longings Salome Between Nietzsche and Freud"The Gale Group. Sage Publications. Retrieved 1 December 2016.
  13. Jump up to:a b Philippe Jaccottet, Rilke par lui-même, 1970, p.29
  14. ^ Philippe Jaccottet, Rilke par lui-même, 1970, p.29–30
  15. ^ Gerald Stieg, 2007, p.979-980
  16. ^ Roudinesco and Plon, 2011, p. 65
  17. ^ "Lou Andreas-Salomé © 2003-2012 by Prof. Dr. med. K. Sadegh-Zadeh"www.lou-andreas-salome.de. Retrieved 6 April 2020.
  18. ^ Heinz F. Peters: Lou Andreas-Salomé: Das Leben einer außergewöhnlichen Frau. Kindler, München 1964, S. 7 (Vorwort, ohne Quellenangabe).
  19. ^ Livingstone, Angela (1984). Salomé: Her Life and Work. London: Gordon Fraser Gallery. pp. 246–248.
  20. ^ "Lou Andreas-Salomé Werkedition"andreas-salome.medienedition.de. Retrieved 25 June 2021.
  21. ^ Popova, Maria (12 February 2015). "Lou Andreas-Salomé, the First Woman Psychoanalyst, on Human Nature in Letters to Freud"Brain Pickings. Retrieved 17 July 2017.
  22. ^ Andreas-Salome, Lou (April 2022). ""Anal" and "Sexual""Psychoanalysis and History24 (1): 19–40. doi:10.3366/pah.2022.040. Retrieved 21 January 2023.
  23. ^ Freud, Sigmund. Richards, Angela, editor. Three Essays on the Theory of Sexuality and Other Works. The Penguin Freud Library, Vol. 7 Penguin. (1977) ISBN 9780140137972 pp.295-302
  24. ^ "Anneliese's House"Boydell and Brewer. Retrieved 25 June 2021.
  25. ^ "Books of The Times – Her Friends Included Nietzsche, Rilke and Freud"The New York Times. 10 May 1991.
  26. ^ Peters, 'My Sister, My Spouse', p. 300
  27. ^ Wilson, Katharina M. (1991). An Encyclopedia of Continental Women Writers. New York and London: Garland Publishing, Inc.
  28. ^ "When Nietzsche Wept"Litmed.med.nyu.edu. Retrieved 5 December 2015.
  29. ^ "La hora sin diosas"Alfaguara.com. Retrieved 4 December 2015.
  30. ^ Bayer, WilliamThe Luzern PhotographISBN 978-0-7278-8546-3
  31. ^ Bruno Bosteels (21 August 2012). Marx and Freud in Latin America: Politics, Psychoanalysis, and Religion in ... p. 237. ISBN 9781844678471. Retrieved 5 December 2015.
  32. ^ The Truth about LouISBN 1-58243-358-5
  33. ^ Vienna TriangleISBN 978-0-916727-50-5
  34. ^ A Book for All and NoneISBN 978-0-7538-2892-2
  35. ^ Freud's Bird of PreyISBN 1-891944-03-7
  36. ^ Re-CallISBN 1905512201
  37. ^ "Lou Salome: Muse, Geliebte, Therapeutin"Musik in Dresden. 6 February 2012. Retrieved 4 December 2015.
  38. ^ "In Love with Lou"World Literature Today. 22 June 2016. Retrieved 17 July 2017.

References[edit]

  • Astor, Dorian: Lou Andreas-Salomé, Gallimard, folio biographies, 2008; ISBN 978-2-07-033918-1
  • Binion, R., Frau Lou: Nietzsche's Wayward Disciple, foreword by Walter KaufmannPrinceton, Princeton University Press, 1968
  • Freud, S. and Lou Andreas-Salome: Letters, New York: Norton, 1985
  • Jaccottet, PhilippeRilke par lui-même, Paris, Seuil, coll. " Ecrivains de toujours ", 1970, " Naissance de Rainer-Maria ", p. 29–37
  • Livingstone, Angela: (1984). Lou Andreas Salomé: Her Life and Work. London: Gordon Fraser, 1984; ISBN 0918825040
  • Michaud, Stéphane: Lou Andreas-Salomé. L'alliée de la vie. Seuil, Paris 2000; ISBN 2-02-023087-9
  • Pechota Vuilleumier, Cornelia: 'O Vater, laß uns ziehn!' Literarische Vater-Töchter um 1900. Gabriele Reuter, Hedwig Dohm, Lou Andreas- Salomé. Olms, Hildesheim 2005; ISBN 3-487-12873-X
  • Pechota Vuilleumier, Cornelia: Heim und Unheimlichkeit bei Rainer Maria Rilke und Lou Andreas-Salomé. Literarische Wechselwirkungen. Olms, Hildesheim 2010; ISBN 978-3-487-14252-4
  • Peters, H. F., My Sister, My Spouse: A Biography of Lou Andreas-Salome, New York: Norton, 1962
  • Roudinesco, Elisabeth et Michel Plon, Dictionnaire de la psychanalyse, Paris, Fayardcoll. " La Pochothèque ", 2011 (1re éd. 1997) (ISBN 978-2-253-08854-7), " Andreas-Salomé Lou, née Liola (Louise) von Salomé (1861–1937). Femme de lettres et psychanalyste allemande ", p. 63–68
  • Salomé, Lou: The Freud Journal, Texas Bookman, 1996
  • Salomé, Lou: Friedrich Nietzsche in seinen Werken, 1894; Eng., Nietzsche, tr. and ed. Siegfried Mandel, Champaign, Illinois: University of Illinois Press Univ. of Illinois Press, 2001
  • Salomé, Lou: You Alone Are Real to Me: Remembering Rainer Maria Rilke, tr. Angela von der Lippe, RochesterBOA Editions, 2003
  • Stieg, Gerald: « Rilke (Rainer Maria) », in Dictionnaire du monde germanique , Dir: É. Décultot, M. Espagne et J. Le Rider, Paris, Bayard, 2007, p. 979–980 (ISBN 9782227476523)
  • Vollmann, William T.Friedrich Nietzsche: The Constructive NihilistThe New York Times, 14 August 2005.
  • Vickers, Julia: Lou von Salome: A Biography of the Woman who Inspired Freud, Nietzsche and Rilke. McFarland 2008

External links[edit]

When Nietzsche Wept | Full Drama Movie | WORLD MOVI...



When Nietzsche Wept (Когато Ницше плака) | Full Drama Movie | WORLD MOVIE CENTRAL

World Movie Central
215K subscribers
-----

123,521 views  Premiered Nov 1, 2021  #FreeYouTubeMovies #WorldMovieCentral #DramaMovies
Viennese doctor Josef Breuer meets with philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche to help him deal with his despair.
2007 | Stars: Ben Cross, Armand, Assante, Joanna Pacula | Director: Pinchas Perry | Writers: Pinchas PerryIrvin D. Yalom(novel)
**This film is under license from Walla Entertainment.  All rights reserved***

Binge-watch more here:   

 / worldmoviecentral  
★ SUBSCRIBE FOR MORE WORLD MOVIES★ 
Do not forget to click the notification bell to get more World Movies like this and share your thrilling experience.
*** World Movie Central - a collection of great action, horror, comedy, family, and other genres of movies that are translated into multiple languages and with subtitles.

#WorldMovieCentral #FullMovies #FreeYouTubeMovies #FullMultipleLanguageMovies #DramaMovies

Taechang Kim 서양인의 무신론, 일본인의 무종교

(14) Facebook


Taechang Kim

Comments
Taechang Kim
一読して日本人
の考え方の基本を理解するのに
参考になりました。著者は言ってます。
"歴史的に見ると、一神教の神、仏教の空-
縁起のそれぞれには、次のような文化的副産物
があったように
思われる。一神
教の神の概念は、実体をはっきりさせ、物事のシロクロ(二元的対立)をはっきりさせる
姿勢とむすびついてきた。これがさらに古代ギリシャ伝来の数理的伝統と結びつくことで、近代科学を生み出した。しかし対立を強調する思考は、神をめぐる保守とリベラルの思想的対立も生み出した。保守が超保守化
することでファンダメンタリズムがうまれ、反科学の潮流が生まれた。リベラルが超リベラル化したのが無神論だ。こちらは
反宗教を提唱している。文化現象としては、無神論もまた一神
教の神信仰の派生物なのである。これに対して、仏教の空の
概念は、物事の
シロクロをはっきりさせず、すべてを曖昧な相互依存関係の中で見ていく傾向
を許容し、また
涵養した。こうした伝統から科学も合理的な民主的討論の制度も生まれない。面白いのは、仏教社会どこでも、科学を生み出さなかった一方で、科学を輸入することに抵抗が無かったことだ。何事にもぬらりひょんなところがあり、反進化論や反同性愛に血道を上げる原理主義者
がいない一方で、無神論やLG
BTの人権闘争で
社会が燃えることもない。<創造の神>と<空-縁起>を対照させるこうした図式はあくまでも
ここだけの仮説にすぎない。しかしこの図式は
伝統的な文化論
の図式と無関係
ではない。昭和
時代には、西洋と日本(あるいは東洋)とを対比する議論が流行した。西田幾多郎によれば、西洋は<有>の文化、日本は<無>
の文化である。丸山真男は聖書が<つくる>神話、古事記は<なる>神話であることに注目した。人類学者ルース-ベネデイクトの<罪>の文化と<恥>の文化を対照させる理論はかなり流行した。ユング派の河合隼雄は西洋人は意識の中心としての<自我>に焦点をもち、日本人は無意識内の<自己>に焦点をもつというふうに図式化した。いずれも意志的でガッチリしたものと関係的で曖昧なものとの対照になっている。<創造の神>
VS<空-縁起>の
図式がこれら先達たちの対照と
関係があることは、おわかりいただけるだろう。欧米社会と日本のあらゆる
文化の諸相をこうした観念の枠組みでとらえるのは行き過ぎかとも思う。それに世界には欧米と日本しかないわけじゃないだろう。それでも、無神論をめぐる彼我の違いについては、<創造の神>VS
<空-縁起>の対照が有効だとおもうのである"。
(pp. 283-284)
著者の意見に賛同しますか?

Kurozumi Makoto
ある程度の理屈また文化論としては賛成しますが、人間の体験自体まで考えると、とてもいい加減な客観主義のようで全く賛成できません。大抵、人生上や仕事上で上手く行った人がそうした議論をします。ただ、宗教をとらえるときに体験となる事態が大事で、そこに霊性論やその良し悪し等も出て来ると思われます。その意味で、学問のあり方自体を反省すべきです。昭和前期に、和辻哲郎が『原始基督教の文化史的意義』というのを書いて、基督教内部から批判されたり考えたりした歴史があります。そうしたことも考えねば、キリスト教も仏教もその実質は消えると思われ、そうした日本史をもっと反省してほしいです。

Taechang Kim
黒住 真 様、仰る通りで、まず
基礎的な一般論として理解し、そこから、より深い体感-体験-
体得の次元に踏み込むというわたくし自身のアプローチの仕方で対話を促す "呼び水"のようなものです。勿論、わたくし自身の所見は本格的な対話が進む
段階になれば自ずから出て来る
ことにならざるを得ませんでしよう。



柳生真
日本の場合は神道の「国土崇拝」という別の軸もあるような気がします。これは一神教の唯一神・創造神とも仏教の空・縁起とも異質なものだと思います。

柳生真 様、それに関連する議論は鎌田東二教授との二回の対談を通して深めた
ことがあります。例えば日本人の霊性は大地
(日本国土)への
根降ろし=土着化に拘るのに対して韓国人は(特に日帝時代の国土簒奪以後)大地=国土よりも
天(宇宙)への自由な飛翔を願う
という特性を持つと言ったことが思い出されます。



Kurozumi Makoto
キリスト教でのキリスト・受肉(托身)とか仏教での菩薩とか、いったことをとらえ考えるべきで、それはどうなのでしょうか。金先生の活私にも繋がります。

Taechang Kim
だから、中村圭志さんの見解はそれとして認めながらわたくし自身の考えとしては西洋との比較という観点からも、また内向的な日本論としてもやや単純化
し過ぎたところがあるのではないでしょうか?
しかし、そういうのがよく受けるというが、どうも、日本的な
habitusであるというのも否定
できないでしょう。
===
읽고 일본인의 사고방식의 기본을 이해하는데 도움이 되었습니다. 저자는 말합니다. "역사적으로 보면, 일신교의 신, 불교의 하늘 - 인기 각각에는 다음과 같은 문화적 부산물이 있었던 것처럼 보인다. 일신교의 신의 개념은 실체를 분명히 하고 사물의 시로쿠로(이원적 대립)를 뚜렷하게 하는 자세와 흩어져 왔다.이것이 한층 더 고대 그리스 전래의 수리적 전통과 결합하는 것으로, 근대 과학을 낳았다.그러나 대립을 강조하는 사고는, 하나님을 둘러싼 보수 리버럴의 사상적 대립도 낳았다.보수가 초보수화하는 것으로 펀더멘탈리즘이 태어나, 반과학의 조류가 태어났다.리버럴이 초리버럴화한 것이 무신론이다.이쪽은 반종교를 제창해 문화현상으로서는 무신론도 일신교의 신신앙의 파생물이다.이에 비해 불교의 하늘의 개념은 사물의 시로크로를 분명하게 하지 않고, 모든 것을 모호한 상호 의존관계 가운데서 보아 가는 경향을 허용해, 또 함양했다.이러한 전통으로부터 과학도 합리적인 민주적 토론의 제도도 태어나지 않는다.재미있는 것은, 불교 사회 어디에서나, 과학을 낳지 않았던 한편, 과학을 수입하는 것에 저항이 없었던 일이다.무슨 일에도 적당한 곳이 있어, 반진화론이나 반동성애에 혈도를 올리는 원리주의자가 없는 한편, 무신론이나 LGBT의 인권 투쟁으로 사회가 불타는 일도 없다 <창조의 신>과 <하늘-연기>를 대조시키는 이러한 도식은 어디까지나 여기만의 가설에 지나지 않는다.그러나 이 도식은 전통적인 문화론의 도식과 무관하지 않다.쇼와 시대에는, 서양과 일본(혹은 동양)을 대비하는 논의가 유행했다.니시다 기타로에 의하면, 서양은 <유>의 문화, 일본은 <무>의 문화이다.마루야마 마오는 성경이 <만들다>신화, 고사기 는 <나루> 신화임을 주목했다. 인류학자 루스-베네데이크트의 <죄>의 문화와 <수치>의 문화를 대조시키는 이론은 상당히 유행했다. "자아"에 초점을 맞추고 일본인은 무의식 내에서 "자기"에 초점을 맞추는 방식으로 도식화했습니다. <창조의 신> VS <하늘-연기>의 도식이 이들 선두들의 대조와 관계가 있다는 것을 알 수 있을 것이다.구미사회와 일본의 모든 문화의 제상을 이러한 관념의 틀에서 잡히는 것은 지나치다고 생각한다.게다가 세계에는 구미와 일본밖에 없는 것이 아닐 것이다.그래도, 무신론을 둘러싼 그아의 차이에 대해서는, <창조의 신>VS<하늘-연기>의 대조가 유효 그렇다고 생각하는 것이다. (pp. 283-284) 저자의 의견에 찬동하십니까? . 대부분 인생상이나 일상에서 잘 간 사람이 그러한 논의를 합니다. 다만, 종교를 파악할 때 체험이 되는 사태가 중요하고, 거기에 영성론이나 그 좋고 나쁜 등도 나온다고 생각됩니다. 그 의미에서, 학문의 본연의 자체를 반성해야 합니다. 쇼와 전기에, 와즈지 테츠로가 『원시 기독교의 문화사적 의의』라고 하는 것을 써, 기독교 내부로부터 비판되거나 생각하거나 한 역사가 있습니다. 그런 것도 생각하면 기독교도 불교도 그 실질은 사라진다고 생각되고 그러한 일본사를 더 반성해 주었으면 합니다. 
Taechang Kim 쿠로스미 마사마, 말씀대로, 우선 기초적인 일반론으로 이해하고, 거기에서, 보다 깊은 체감-체험-체득의 차원에 밟는다고 하는 나 자신의 어프로치의 방법으로 대화를 재촉하는 "부르는 물"과 같이 입니다. 물론, 내 자신의 소견은 본격적인 대화가 진행되는 단계가 되면 스스로 나오게 될 수밖에 없을 것이다. 야나기 마코토 일본의 경우는 신도의 「국토 숭배」라고 하는 다른 축도 있는 것 같은 생각이 듭니다. 이것은 일신교의 유일한 신·창조신 모두 불교의 하늘·연기도 이질적인 것이라고 생각합니다. 야나기 마사마, 그것에 관련된 논의는 가마타 히가시지 교수와의 두 번의 대담을 통해 깊어진 적이 있습니다. 예를 들어 일본인의 영성은 대지(일본 국토)에의 뿌리 내림=토착화에 구애되는 것에 대해 한국인은 (특히 일제시대의 국토 탈탈 이후) 대지=국토보다 하늘(우주)에의 자유 한 비상을 바란다는 특성을 가진다고 말한 것이 기억됩니다.